REPOST: Touch not the Lord’s anointed

One of the bible verses thrown at us most frequently by TB Joshua’s fans is Psalm 105:15, “Touch not the Lord’s anointed”. In other words, how dare we question or critisise this anointed man of God? SCOAN clearly support this use of the verse, since they use it at the beginning of their “Beware of Blasphemers” video. We briefly explained why this is a total misuse of scripture in our post reviewing that video.

Recently a reader sent us a link to an excellent article by Conrad Mbewe, an African Pastor and author we’ve linked to before in “The state of African Christianity”. Recently Pastor Mbewe devoted a whole article to Psalm 105:15 and its popular misapplication. We encourage you to read the entire post, but here we include some excerpts.

If there has been a phrase in the Bible that has been recently tortured until it confesses a lie, it is the phrase, “Touch not the Lord’s anointed.” I hear it a lot in Christian conversation today. Usually, the phrase is meant to caution anyone who is criticising the questionable teaching or way of life of a famous preacher or church leader. That is meant to be a no-go area.

The popular understanding of this phrase is that if you say negative things about “an anointed servant of God,” something nasty will happen to you. You might even die a horrible death.

Yep, that’s something we’ve been warned of multiple times. “…may God forgive those that condemn the Man of God […] Least you forget the penalty for condemnation of a Man of God” a commenter once warned us. Someone on Facebook warned us of the destructions God was going to bring upon us:

Screenshot 21:01:2013 20:33

Another facebook commenter is even more explicit about the harm that God is going to bring on us (given the content of the post, we’ve intentionally left his name visible)

TB Joshua WatchMbewe continues:

This is African traditional religion creeping into the church through the back door. In Africa, you do not say anything negative against an elderly person or a chief or a witchdoctor. If you do, something nasty will happen to you. You can even grow a beard at the back of you neck!

So how do we apply this verse today? Is it a correct to use it as a rebuke to people like us?

No, says Mbewe.

“Touch not the Lord’s anointed” is about harm, especially physical harm, and not legitimate criticism. Public teachers must be above reproach. That is one of their qualifications. If they meddle in heretical teaching or immoral living, they disqualify themselves. Thus, those of us who are aware of their devious dealings or dangerous teachings must sound the public alarm. We must warn the unwary lest they fall prey to them. Public sins must be rebuked publicly.

He then goes on to mention two times in the New Testament when Paul (2 Tim 2:16-18) and John (2 John 9-10) publicly call out leaders in the church who are teaching heresy or living immoral lifestyles. Were they guilty of disobeying Psalm 105:15? Of course not! (Pastor Mbewe goes into further details about the biblical context of the verse in his full post)

Commenter “Candle holder” has been regularly accusing us and other commenters of slandering TB Joshua. Is that a fair accusation? Here’s what Pastor Mbewe has to say on the issue.

In each case, I am not justifying libel or slander. But that is not the issue here. The phrase “touch not the Lord’s anointed” is not being used against character assassination. Rather it is being used to stop people coming forward to testify against immoral and heretical preachers. Corruption in the church is multiplying while the silent majority dare not speak out lest they touch the Lord’s anointed. It is an epidemic! Extreme Charismatic pastors are emptying church coffers in order to line their own pockets and impregnating girls in the churches but those who have the evidence cannot speak out lest they touch the Lord’s anointed and something bad happens to them. That is the issue at hand. Clearly, that understanding of Psalm 105:15 and 1 Samuel is wrong.

But should the correction be done privately rather than publicly? In some cases, yes – but in others, no. Mbewe explains:

Love demands that I rescue those whom I love from danger. So, if the preacher who has gone into immoral living or heretical teaching is someone I have a personal relationship with, love ought to compel me to talk with him privately with a view to restoring him to biblical orderliness. However, where his repentance is not as notorious as his sin, or I do not have such a relationship with him, or his heretical teachings or immoral life have become too widespread and are ruining the faith of many, the same love should compel me to oppose him publicly and thus restore the faith of many. Hence, love should cause any true preacher of the word not to keep quiet when the faith of many is being ruined, as is the case today in Africa.

To conclude, we can now see that Psalm 105:15 in no way applies to what TB Joshua Watch does. We show clear evidence of false teaching (example 1, example 2, example 3, example 4 etc…), clear evidence of fraud and deceptions (example 1, example 2, example 3, example 4 etc…) and compelling (though not conclusive – but what evidence would be?) evidence that TB Joshua sexually abuses female disciples in his care (example 1, example 2, example 3 etc…). We have no ability to challenge TB Joshua face to face, although we know people who have (to no avail). TB Joshua’s ministry is widespread, and ruining the faith of many – love compels us to oppose this publicly and thus restore the faith of many.

A note on comments: There have been a huge number of comments recently, many very repetitive and off the topic of the post. In this case, we will only be approving comments relevant to the subject of the post, or direct responses to comments already published.

218 thoughts on “REPOST: Touch not the Lord’s anointed

  1. I think it’s high time we all as human beings critically study the Holy Bible from a scientific viewpoint and confirm if it makes logical sense. That is, does it check out vis a vis our present world realities. I have my doubts. Call me Thomas.

    • The Bible is not a science text and was not meant to be. It is a religious text, with a specific message (the Gospel) presented for a specific purpose, with a variety of writers and perspectives, though all linked by inspiration of the Holy Spirit. If you approach it with that understanding, and read it with an understanding of the genres of literature used within it(historical account, poetry/wisdom writing, parables, etc) it does stand up to scrutiny. Many rational, scientifically minded people have had no trouble loving science while believing in the God of the Bible. Google Francis Collins–head of the human genome project, current head of the NIH, and a Christian.

      Heck, science convinced my dad that there must be a Creator. He could not look at what he was studying in biology and maintain the idea that it all originated from nothingness and developed by random natural selection. That is not an uncommon story.

      God is not afraid of people using their brains. He wants us to do that.
      TB Joshua is afraid though, and his followers as well. In order to believe in him, it is necessary to shut down all reason. Because maintaining any level of critical thinking at all will quickly put a person in the position of either willfully rejecting reality, or rejecting TBJ.

    • I was reading these verses again the other day and thought about TB Joshua.
      I feel that this is relevant.
      This was the reaction of a true Prophet (Anointed One) of God, compared to Tbj?
      John the Baptist:
      Luke 7:28 – For I Jesus says unto you; “Among those that are born of women there is not a greater Prophet than John the Baptist”.
      John 1:19 – Now this was John’s testimony when the Jewish leaders in Jerusalem sent priests and Levites to ask him who he was. 20 He did not fail to confess, but confessed freely, “I am not the Messiah or Anointed One.”
      John 3:30 – He (Jesus) must become greater; I (John) must become less.”
      Mark 6:27 – The man went, beheaded John in the prison.
      It was just the opposite too today. Today these “anointed ones” are becoming more and more and Jesus less and less. I wonder who of them will be prepared to die for the cause of Jesus?

  2. I have been folowing TB Joshua watch for some time now and have found it very informative, very objective and very helpful. This is my first time to post a comment and Would like to tell you guys to keep up the good work. You are spot on about the misapplication of Pslam 105:15! I know of a TB Joshua follower who teaches at my school who use it every time his conduct with school girls is called into question!

    • Oh my goodness, that is so sad. Is there any authority you can appeal to that wouldn’t be afraid of his spiritual manipulation? Somebody needs to protect those girls.

      • By end of March this self proclaimed school pastor will be back to his country of origin. Steps are being taken not to extend his contract. This person comes from the same country as TB Joshua. The sad thing is that this person came as a volunteer teacher due to the critical shortage of qualified teachers in my country, and he is abusing the hospitality accorded to him by my country. AS a result of his conduct my school has decided not to extend his contract.

  3. The ways of the lord is different from our ways. let us allow God to do his work,but be have to do our best. the is our light an salvation whom shall we fear,no one .from every side my TB Joshua is a real man of God.He is my prophet i believe him with no doubt, man of God just extend ur anointing to my life an i shall receive my deliverance.thank you man of God an God bless you in abondance.

  4. TB Joshua Watch – keep up the good work. Like Konrad is saying, your well-reasearched information is very informative. The Lord shall surely reward you for labouring for His Kingdom.

  5. Thanx a lot u guyz are doin great(TB Joshua Watch) ;it’s time To knw The truth about TB Joshua. people let us cling To The bible, And see The kindom of God.

    • Acts 20:26-32
      26 Therefore I –Paul – testify to you this day that I am innocent of the blood of all, 27 for I did not shrink from declaring to you the whole counsel of God. 28 Pay careful attention to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God which he obtained with his own blood.

      29 I know that after my departure FIERCE WOLWES will come in among you, not sparing the flock; 30 and from among your own selves will arise men TWISTING THE TRUTH, to draw away the disciples after them.

      31 Therefore be alert, remembering that for three years I did not cease night or day to admonish every one with tears. 32 And now I commend you to God and to the Word of His grace, which is able to build you up and to give you the inheritance among all those who are sanctified.

  6. Galant. 5:8. “Who has interfered (hindred) you, from heeding and following The Truth? This (evil) persuasion is not from Him who called you,- who invited you to freedom in Christ. A little leave leavens the whole lump. “

  7. This is my last unsolicited post on tbjw.
    I have incontrovertible proof from the New Testament that Christianity is expired/outmoded.
    Aside from the Scriptures, it is evident that Christians nowadays are mentally driven as opposed to Spirit guided in direct contradiction to what is obtainable in Bible times.
    If anyone have not the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.
    How many Christians can honestly claim to have experienced the Holy Spirit Baptism upon giving their lives to Christ?
    How many have driven out demons, picked up snakes, healed the sick e.t.c.?
    How many can claim to have spoken in strange tongues by the Holy Spirit?
    The same Spirit whose firstfruits in Christians was supposed to be a deposit guaranteeing eternal glory?
    The clue to my findings can be found in the 10th and 11th chapters of Genesis.
    I’ll keep the actual KEY until y’all see me on worldwide news channels. I’ll appreciate anyone who can get me 15 minutes on CNN, BBC, AL JAZEERA ETC.
    People need to know the truth.
    I’m blowing Christianity wide open.
    Peace Out!

  8. Touch not the Lord’s anointed:
    Friends, I just returned from a week at SCOAN. I’m an American family man with 2 children, a thriving home, degreed, and what the world would call a successful man. I’m not ‘desperate’, ‘poor’, ‘lost’, ‘dying from sickness’, ‘tormented by demons’, ‘addicted’, or anything else that would put me in a category of being labeled ‘desperate’ or subject to ‘mind control’ as I’ve read. I desired to visit SCOAN because I was intrigued by the videos and testimonies I saw on youtube and emmanuel tv and wanted to see it/feel it with my own eyes. Before leaving on this trip, I admit I did have a very small amount of doubt and a large amount belief that all this was true, that TB Joshua was actually set apart by God to do the things I was seeing on videos…the healings (great and small), the deliverances, the prophesies, and the goodwill (giving) we’re all true and he was indeed a man of God. After spending a week on the premises and participating in the Friday prayer line screening, witnessing the Saturday prayer line (for the local Nigerian residents), attending the Sunday services, the Sunday prayer line (for the international visitors), having the wise man lay hands on me, participating in the prayer line, and having TB Joshua touch me himself (multiple times)…Friends, this is all 100% true. He is indeed, a man anointed by God to heal, deliver, and prophesy (about both people lives and world events). I’ve seen and witnessed literally 100′s of healing (right in front of my eyes), 100′s of deliverances, and at least 50 prophesies where he has randomly spoken to people in the audience about things that only they and God would know. This also includes me…I forgot my prayer card (the big white piece of paper that lists the things I’d like prayer for) in my room. I wasn’t sure when we’d be ushered from the church service to the prayer line so I thought I’d have time to get it in my room, but I didn’t. While standing in the prayer line without a card, as TB Joshua got closer to me I began to wonder what he was going to do when he came. Well, he went right for both of my knees with his hands, laying his hands on both of my knees. The #1 prayer point on my card was my sore knees. You see, I was a Division I basketball player and many many years of banged up knees, including 3 knee surgeries. After the years (I’m 37 years old) they just are simply arthritic and hurt all of the time. Mind you, I’m still very active physically….but I don’t do the very rough stuff anymore like full-court basketball. When me knees were touched they because weak and tinged. I fell to the floor, he motioned for the workers to pick me up again, he touched the other knee and they gave out again…down I went. Today, I write with knees that no longer hurt….the pain is 100% gone. You see, I can only speak about what I’ve seen with other people getting out of wheel chairs, loosing their crutches, baby turning in the womb, and all the other numerous healing I ‘saw’ with my own eyes. But when I comes to myself, I can testify by fact what I not on saw but what I’ve felt and know to be true. I was healed and overcome but he presence of the holy spirit when this man came near.
    And as for his claims of divinity, or being the messiah?…I never once saw pride in him, nor was there ever a moment when someone was healed or delivered and fell to their knees in front of him that he didn’t tell the ‘GET UP’ instantly and “GIVE GLORY TO JESUS”. Not once did he or the wise men (or his staff, or anyone else) say “I have healed you”, he says “Jesus has healed you”.
    Now, let’s think about this rationally. Either these miracles are fake or they’re real. If they’re fake, then TB Joshua is fake…then all of the 1000′s of healings we can all see on youtube or Etv (which of course are edited-there’s not enough tv time in the world to show ALL the filming that doesn’t pertain the actual hearings, don’t you think?, what’s wrong with just showing the healings?…they show enough about the lead-in to the persons situation, the actual healings, and…MORE IMPORTANTLY-THE TESTIMONIES). If they’re fake, then I must be delusional because I’m healed…how can this be? As I said, and pretty much a successful american family man in his right mind…and you’re going to have to discredit me as a person in order to discredit my testimony. But once you do that with me, you’ll have literally 10′s of 1000′s of other people (who are in their right minds) to discredit as well.
    …But if these hearings are real, then what? If they’re real then rationally we must come to the conclusion that they’re either done through God or through Satan. They’re either of Jesus or of the devil. If they’re of the devil, than you’re telling me that the devil has healed my knees?…why would he want me to have joy thorough physical health? Why would the devil want the lame walk? The blind to see? Healed skin disease, hiv, marriages, tumors, the deaf? That simply can’t be because scripture says that Satan’s mission is to kill, steal, and destroy. And what I saw (and experienced in my own body) wasn’t killing, stealing, and destroying….it was new life, joy, peace, happiness, healing, deliverance, freedom from bondage, new beginnings, …etc. Remember the pharisees, who saw the miracles of Jesus with their own eyes…what’s their response? “It’s through satan that you drive out demons”. Jesus then simply reasons, with them logically and says…that cannot be. How can Satan drive out Satan? So true.
    The one thing saw that all of these people who were healed had in common with each other was this…they all had faith that they would be healed. Regardless of the country they were from, the language they spoke, the disease/sickness they had….they all believed 100% they were’ going to be healed. And they were. Simply put friends, TB Joshua IS the Lord’s anointed. Since that is the case, he will only be touched if God allows him to be touched, he will only die…when God’s time for him to die has come. Many people have tried to take him out, I heard many stories about acid attacks, bomb attempts, knives and guns being brought into church that all have supernaturally not been carried out because while on the property of various supernatural reasons of faulted attempts….equipment ‘somehow’ not working at the time, or TB joshua speaking in the service “There is a man here with a gun, please come out”…and sure enough a man comes forward with a gun and surrenders in his ‘awe’ of TB Joshua knowing that he was even there…he then receives deliverance, rehabilitation (he’s given money, food and discipled at the church for a time), and released back into the world to with a jump-start. Those types of stories, wonderful stories of redemption.
    When John the baptist sent messengers to ask Jesus if he was ‘the one’…Jesus responded…”The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor.” Friend’s, please hear me when I say this…This is exactly what is happening at SCOAN. People are healed, people are delivered, their hidden lives are told (John 4:18), and millions of dollars is given to the needy. I’m grateful to God to be living in an exciting time on this earth where there’s a mighty man of God, a Prophet of Biblical proportions on this planet whom I’ve met personally, and felt the power of the Holy spirit in a way that I’ve never felt in my 25 years of being a follower of Jesus.
    This 4-min video that Emmanuel tv just released about TB Joshua’s anointing from the Lord says it all…PS-it’s in the words of an American Evangelist, NOT Scoan, NOT TB Joshua…please watch this and decide for yourself:

    I’d be happy to speak personally with any of you in regards to my experience here…my hope is that you, as I did, would be come from skepticism to the knowledge that God is doing wonderful, life-changing things on this planet in our time, and he’s using TB Joshua to do it. A humble man, who doesn’t live in mansions, hoard money or prides himself in the miracles performed through him, but gives all glory, praise and honor to Jesus Christ.

    • May God bless you with your good experience. There are no skeptics on this site. We have met ‘the other site”of the “good” godman TB Joshua. The tb joshua that is hidden for the public. His violence, his distractions, his false promises, his fabricated stories, his meanness, his mis-use, abuse, adultery, . His crazyness and madness. They are real too.

      • Jamie, I’m sorry to hear those things. I simply don’t have any authority to speak of what I haven’t seen, only what I have seen with my own eyes. And what I saw was a man that God used to do many miracles right in front of my eyes, who teaches to love our neighbor as ourselves, to love our enemies and pray for them, who speaks to broken marriages and encourages them to reconcile and heal. I’m simply here to testify my experience and can’t help but believe if those things are true of him as you say, then he’d not only have lost his anointing from God (as many have done that have fallen from Grace) but he wouldn’t be able to do the things I saw him do. That is, of course, unless his power to heal, speak prophesy and deliver is from Satan…then that takes us back to the conundrum in my initial post about Satan’s mission.

    • You are an American with money. Of course you got the royal treatment and were shown the best face of the organization. :/ Ask yourself why locals and international visitors are separated? Hm? Are y’all with the money too good to be mixed with the unwashed masses? Is that how Christ’s Church operates? Have you read James chapter 2 recently?
      I won’t say you’re delusional. I will say that the power of suggestion has been proven time and time again to be very effective, even when performed by completely secular people. And people skilled in this are also often skilled in information mining, not just from written or spoken information, but from body language. Johnathan Edwards and other spiritualists, as well as hypnotists, make a killing doing this kind of stuff. His HIV healings are demonstrably fakes. The rest? I’ve never seen a limb regrown instantly. If it had happened, E-TV would have been sure to have trumpeted that to the world, don’t you think? The “instant” healings like your sore knees are easily explainable by the placebo effect, which is extraordinarily powerful. The gorey open wounds they like to show–NEVER instant healing with instantly regrown perfectly healthy skin. People come back *weeks* later with scarred over wounds and give the glory of that “healing” to TBJ. Wounds heal, with care and time.
      If some of the healings are faked, which we know they are, what does that say about TBJ’s character? Does an annointed many of God fake healings? Does God need fake healings to glorify himself?
      We are not talking about killing TBJ. “Touch not God’s annointed” is an abusively misused phrase in Scripture intended to scare people out of asking questions and holding church leadership accountable. The fact that SCOAN followers feel the need to speak curses and threats at anyone who does not agree that TBJ is God’s annointed tells a lot about the sickness that abides in that group.
      We already know that God does great and wonderful things in this world. We don’t *need* TBJ to know that, or to see it in operation, or to experience a full relationship with God. The fact that an “American Evangelist” (care to name who) supports him is meaningless, because there are plenty of American preachers who are just as bad as he is, making their living off of twisting the word of God.
      I’m glad your knees feel better. The fact that they feel better, however, does not validate TBJ’s ministry as “annointed of God.” Espcially not in the face of the *facts* of his faked healings and Scripture distortions.

      • Oh, I just looked it up. Benny Hinn supports TB Joshua??? No kidding? Oh well, that settles it for me.
        Birds of a feather flock together. Charlatans and scammers promote each other all the time. I am wholly unimpressed. If TBJ was a humble, righteous man, he would not want the support and promotion of someone like Benny Hinn. He’s looking for further inroads into wealthy American churches, and I guess he finally found it. Clever man.
        But not God’s annointed.

      • bahaha. Sorry for post spamming. I can’t help it.
        I dug a little more, and all that E-TV has on youtube of Benny Hinn is an interview where he pimps for TB Joshua (“SEND IN YOUR MONEY, Y’ALL!” who was it that said SCOAN never asks for money???) and admits he’s never met the man.
        Wow. And we’re supposed to decide that TBJ is a real annointed man of God based on that. Sorry. Not happening.

      • Did you notice the strange purple blurring on the right of that Benny Hinn video? That’s there to obscure the interviewer, because he left SCOAN several years ago and in his leaving letter exposed some of the terrible things that happened there.

      • M-Who says I have money? Who says I got royal treatment when I there? Who says I was separated from the locals?….you assume too much friend. I slept in a bunk bed with other people from other countries (not all white by the way), I had no ‘suite’ and ate the same food (rice, fish, chicken) that everyone else ate. I sat in the same church service that everybody else sat in. Of course, they have an ‘international visitors’ section in church there where the folks visiting from other countries have reserved seating (it would be dumb to travel all the way across the world to attend a service to discover there’s no seats for me because all of the local Nigerians took them…don’t ya think?) And as for color, I had 2 ‘Black’ people on each side of me (in the so-called ‘preferential …one from Ghana, and another from S. Africa. While I was able to meet him, and receive prayer multiple times…I was, buy no means, given preferential treatment, nor asked for money. There were many ‘wealthier’ and ‘whiter’ folks there that did not get see/meet him intimately as I did. Your ‘race/preferential treatment’ argument simply doesn’t hold any water. The rest of your ‘assumptions’ I can’t speak to either. Simply put, he heals people of HIV and you discredit that…they come back with their new blood tests and you discredit that as clinically fake or ‘staged’ or ‘paid off’…I tell you my knees were healed and you’ve discredit that as well. Years and years of banging on my knees from playing a high-level of basket ball, 3 knee surgeries, and now I had arthritic knees that aches all of the time and you say they’re healed from the ‘placebo effect’??? M-I’m beginning to believe that I can lead you to water but I can’t force you to drink…there’s only so much I can say/do. All I have is my own testimony, what I saw with my own eyes friend. Your assumptions/accusation around eerily similar to the pharisees response to Jesus healing of the blind man in John 9…my response to you is one thing I do know…I was healed and saw other healed as well (John 9:25). I’ve never seen limbs grow back either…do limbs have to grow back right in front of your face in order for you to believe he’s anointed from God. I have a strong hunch, that even if that happened in front of you, that you’d still find a way to discredit it, yes? Here’s a good one for you to watch and discredit as well…

        or this one…

        Simply put friend, if you think and believe in the bottom of your heart that he’s a fake (and thus all of these 1000′s of healings, deliverances, testimonies, charitable giving are all fake as well) then that’s your foundation and there’s nothing I will be be able to say or do or show you that will convince you otherwise. All I can do is share my story and speak what I believe to be true (just as you did and the many other on this site). I have nothing wrong with questioning, or even doubting things. As i mentioned earlier, I had some doubts as well. But again, I’ve seen and I’ve tasted with my own eyes and I believe 100%. I wouldn’t throw all ‘scoan followers’ in the same group. As you know, certain people are more zealous than other (and all still fallen human beings)…whether in the political realm, our spiritual beliefs, or how the environment is treated…there’s people who wrongfully commit sin in ‘zeal’ for their cause…that’s a given. People love TB Joshua for various reasons, some of them he’s impacted in a serious way, even saved their lives…it’s understandable (although still sin) when someone reacts in defense of him in an over-zealous way. I’d defend zealously if someone attacked by beloved wife or children (even verbally)…because they mean so much to me.
        Of course we don’t ‘need’ TBJ, noe does god ‘need’ you or I, nor does God ‘need’ TBJ to do his work. My his grace he has chosen TBJ to do great works, which I have seen…and regardless of your accusations I simply can only testify to what I know…and it is this. I was blind and now I see. Grace and Peace

      • Cory, if you are from the West, you “have money”, in the eyes of Africans and SCOAN. Anyone who can accomplish international travel, which is very expensive, is someone whose coffers they would like to get into. You’re the one who made sure to mention seperate prayer lines and reserved seating. It would be dumb not to have special seating? Go read James 2 and get back to me on that. Why are you too good to sit in an overflow room, if TBJ is that special? If distance is not a barrier, why do you have to be touched by him for healing? Why did you have to travel at all? Bunking with other international visitors means you were bunking with “the elite”. By royal treatment I did not mean all-white, nor did I mean luxury. I meant you were shown special favor, and you were shown the happy face of the group.
        The fact that you justify sinful behavior of TBJs followers tells me all I need to know about how deep into this you are. There is ZERO justification for people cursing and threatening in the face of QUESTIONS asked and FACTS presented. The curses you see at the top of the page are not in response to threats against TBJ. They are in response to questions about the veracity of his claims. Defend with the Bible, and with reason. That is what is being presented to you, return it in kind and don’t tell me it’s OK for people who are “zealous” for TBJ to curse and spit. If they are that zealous for him, their passion is totally misplaced. He is not God, he is not Jesus, he is not LIKE Jesus, he is not “the prophet of this age”, and questioning him is absolutely not like the Pharisees. So rebut with the Bible, and with reason. End of story.
        There are thousands of men just like TBJ, calling themselves THE prophet, doing exactly what he does, teachign exactly what he does, selling annointed water and other bits of crap to their followers, having people call them “Daddy”, parading “miracles” before congregations and cameras, making vague and unverifiable “prophecies” gathering thousands of followers locally and internationally. Tell me, what differentiates him from them? Nothing. He is no different than the rest of them. He just happens to be the one that caught your attention and fooled you. Let me tell you something–TBJ is nothing special. He is one among thousands. If there is anything that distinguishes him, it’s that he is slightly cleverer than the others and has caught on to the concept of social media marketing before the others did.
        I can see that you have the wool thoroughly pulled over your eyes. And you’re right, you will not convince me. I have the Bible, I have the Holy Spirit, and I have my God-given brain. All are operational and useful for discernment. I have seen plenty of evidence, both from those who have experienced SCOAN and from the lips of TBJ himself, that he is not a Bible preacher, much less a valid prophet of Almighty God. I’ve already had one experience with a cult in my life time, I won’t be taken in again, because I know the tactics–love-bombing, us vs. them, elitism. Not to mention manipulative presentation of information and D-level shoddy acting.
        The point about the regrowing limbs is not that I need to see them. It is that that is the only thing that cannot be explained by commonly known tricks of the scam preacher’s trade. If God heals instantly and completely, then it is ridiculous to have people coming back *weeks* after being prayed for with scars, and saying TBJ healed them “instantly”. Nonsense. If God heals instantly and completely, then it is laughable to say that a man who had trouble walking is “healed” when he clearly still has trouble walkign. If God is doing these miracles, then the pomp and emotional manipulation characteristic of SCOAN is wholly unnecessary, and thus leads to the question of whether they are miracles at all. God doesn’t need manipulation, editing, commentary, and emotional hype. If TBJ needs those things, then I question his claim to be a prophet of God.
        I only pray that TBJ obsession won’t cost you too much in time, health, or relationships before you realize the truth. The reason this blog exists is because he has destroyed lives and families. I am here in part because of the evil influence that man had on my husband who is already a broken, hurting, and unhealthy man. (Word to the wise, if loved ones question your involvement, it would be best not to tell them they are demon posessed and need deliverance. Some may forgive you when you come to your senses, but others may have some difficulty with restoring a relationship you take an ax to like that) Watch all the E-TV you want. But don’t say you weren’t warned, a few years from now.

    • Hi Cory

      Thanks for the comment. M has done a good job responding to you, it’s beyond any doubt that you will have received preferential treatment because of your race and wealth. I assume you got good seats in the service? Maybe some face time (one to one or in a group) with TBJ? You got prayed for by him. You were probably given certain merchendise for free that others would have to pay for. I expect you appeared on camera either in the live service or interviewed individually? Being a westerner guarantees you an impressive time at SCOAN.

      In addition to the above, I want to give you something else to think about. What use is a counterfeit if it looks completely different to the real thing? Of course a counterfeit church/ministry will look very similar to a real church/ministry. What would be the point otherwise?

      I encourage you to read the testimonies on this site, you will see there have been many lives shattered (and in some cases ended) by this ministry. I have been following it for over a decade, I know many people who have been or are still involved in the ministry. My concerns have not sprung up overnight.

      • I’ve addressed the preferential treatment in my response to M above. As for the argument that he’s in fact a counterfeit…I’ve read some of the accusations on your site. I simply can’t defend them all, all I can do is testify to what I’ve seen and felt myself. Are you saying that he’s a fake/counterfeit then?…meaning that 100% of his healings, deliverances, prophesies are all fake then as well?…or just some of them? I’m assuming you’re taking the route that him (and they) are 100% fake, including mine then? That is a pretty darn hefty claim…to negate 10′s of thousands of peoples healings, deliverances, and more importantly…their testimonies. If he’s fake, then what ‘force’ knocked me over?…twice…from just a soft touch to the knees. Who told TB Joshua that I had arthritic knees anyway, how would he know? (see my original post about forgetting my prayer card). He wouldn’t have known any other way than divinely. Unless, he has someone sneak in my room, dig through my backpack when I wasn’t there and read my prayer card that read ‘sore knees’ on it and come back to tell him. What happened to me was real….the tingling feeling that went through my knees when touched them, the unexplainable force that knocked a big 6’9”, 235lb. whiteboy like me backwards on my rear from a simple touch to my knees-twice (which, by the way was just a touch…not a ‘push’ as some claim). Regardless of some rogue statements and claims and all of the negative things I’ve read on this site…I can’t question what happened to me nor the other thousands of people who have been touched and healed by God’s Holy Spirit through the man this website aims to bash….TB Joshua. Again, we can speak against what things ‘look’ like and speculate about what we perceive, but isn’t what we experience (see, taste, touch) the ‘real thing’…not just what is seen? I testify to what not only I have seen, but what I have experienced. Thank you for posting my comments, I understand I’m swimming upstream on this website and appreciate you grace in allowing me to join this conversation. Thank You

      • Cory, nobody’s denying that you had an experience. We’re asking to consider where it came from. And why you had to travel across the world to get it, if the man you went to see is genuine in his claims that distance is not a barrier.

        This explains quite well why “experience”, even a dramatic one, does not validate a ministry. It is worth watching the whole thing.

  9. Anoited God-men, do everything, to receive the ‘special’ anoiting of every God-man they can find. The more anoiting on them, the better they believe they will go. It is all stupidity, selffischness and ego. God has already given us all, all what we need by the finished works of His son, Jezus Christ. Some people just have never enough, they believe that more is better. Benny Hin has never understood the dept of God, nor does TB Joshua. Anoited junks, with private air-plains, and with knowledge on the level of begging childeren. How to reign a ministery? Pass God and let the members pay. amen.

  10. @ the American

    I went there same way as he told several times. I was never healed of anything. Nor my wife, nor anyone we stood proxy for. Why would my non healing and of others not be taken for true ? Anyways you can read my posts elsewhere in other articles.

    • Cory,
      Please read all on this blog, before commenting. Well answered M. We all started of the same way as you did, but found out +/-10-14 years later that tbj is a brilliantly, clever deceitful, nigerian trickster. We will give you some time to hopefully come around and wake up to smell the rat in scoan.

      • Again, I went there and saw people get out of wheelchairs, I heard hours of testimonies of barrenness-for example (one was my roommate coming back with his little girl to testify to what doctors couldn’t fix in surgery), broken bones (x-rays, before/after)…and more important, I received healing and prophesy myself (validated to be true). You can try to negate those all you want…I saw them with my own eyes, I spoke to the people who were involved, I heard their testimonies. I don’t have the time to read every accusation on this blog…do you have the time to watch the 1000′s of video’s testimonies? This brilliant, clever, nigerian man is doing the works of God and ‘deceiving’ a bunch of normal people just like me by healing us of our sickness and diseases, and delivering us from the evil spirits that torment our lives…if that the case then he needs to keep on deceiving them/us because the lame walk, the blind see, and deaf hear. This man you call ‘rat’ is indeed the Lords anointed…that’s my story and I’m sticking to it. 10 or 14 years later will have no effect on what I experienced when I was there. I will forever remember my stay at SCOAN and thank the Lord that I took the leap of faith to journey across the world and see it for myself.

      • Hi Cory, thanks for your gracious interactions with us. I’m not exaggerating when I say that in the 4 years TBJW has operated, you could count on the fingers of one hand the number of people who have debated with us in a gracious and mature way.

        I understand exactly where you are coming from, SCOAN put on an impressive show. As a charismatic Christian, you can’t help but be impressed at first. However, I want to qualify what I mean by fake or counterfeit. I don’t mean that they are all outright lies. I know in some cases they are, I know 3 people who quit their life preserving medication after TB Joshua pronounced them healed (he also advised them to quit their medication as a sign of faith), all three of these people subsequently died. In these cases, the “healing” was an outright lie, but I’m not convinced that’s always the case. A counterfeit bears a close resemblance to the real thing. A coin will bear the same emblem, will be made out of material that looks the same (to an untrained eye) and will in some cases even work (it will be accepted as genuine currency). The same goes for fake or counterfeit healing, it will yield some kind of result, it will make the person feel better in some way, in some cases it might even yield a long term result. This might be down to the placebo effect, the power of suggestion, or even dark spiritual powers (the false prophets in Matthew 24:24 performed “great signs and wonders”). God’s gifts come free, satans come at a cost. Every family I know who has got involved in SCOAN has been torn apart. I’ve known committed Christians who have been disciples at SCOAN and left suicidal (see Beth’s tragic story). Even before starting this site I’d seen a lot of tragic consequences to involvement with TBJ, but so many more have come to my attention now. Even recently I’ve been in conversation with a Christian journalist who covered TBJ many years back (in a positive way) and is now worried about the spiritual consequences of having been “delivered” by TB Joshua, he’s concerned at what power it was that delivered him?

        When you look closer, you see that every aspect of TBJ’s ministry is a counterfeit. Many have died as a result of his fake healings (there are lots of stories on this site), deliverances are similar to what we read in the bible, but different in some quite critical ways (read here), his prophecies are vague and heavily edited, capitalising on major disasters to make a name for himself. Even his charitable giving looks like the pharisee blowing the trumpet to let everyone know what he’s doing (but the trumpet being Emmanuel TV). His teaching is bible based in one sense, but often taken terribly out of context.

        Pursue it if you must, but I hope the dialogue here might help you to reconsider. The main thing is that you don’t start thinking that SCOAN is the only (or one of the only) places God is operating. SCOAN is a circus, it’s impressive, it’s a show, but it’s not real. There are churches in every city in your country which are really serving God, they may not have a TV show, they might not have deliverance shows or “blood of Jesus” branded anointed water, but they’re humble and sincere disciples of Christ. You don’t need to to go to Nigeria, you don’t need to put your family (or even your life) at risk. I sincerely hope and pray that you heed our warnings.

      • Cory, I was watching Emmanuel TV before I found this blog. I couldn’t help it because my husband had it running at full volume every hour that he was home and not sleeping. I knew from the very beginning that there was something off. 1. There is outright blasphemy in many of them, which TBJ would not broadcast if he was the humble man of God you claim he is. And 2. It requires truly shutting down one’s brain to believe some of the tall tales on E-TV. I cannot even comprehend how so many others don’t seem aware of how much acting is going on there, how much is clearly and obviously staged, and how much is a result of clever use of suggestion combined with hyper emotional congregants. And yes, suggestion is powerful enough to knock over even a big dude like you, and cause you to do and feel things that seem extraordinary. That doesn’t mean that the experience was from God.

        I can think of a few videos in particular that set off my alarm bells and set me to searching both Scripture and internet to learn more of what was going on.

        Nothing at SCOAN is new. The stuff you describe has been seen (and exposed as false) time and again in America from various preachers. And you know what? Someone may well have been into your things at SCOAN. Information mining is the norm in churches like this. Unless you stayed absolutely silent up to the moment you met TBJ, there is a strong likelihood that one of those nice church workers and church members and other visitors you met was tasked with gathering information.

        You know who else had people getting up from wheelchairs, vomiting “cancers” out, and giving amazing testimonies of healing? You know who else was initially renowned for his humility, charity, and care for the poor? Jim Jones. Yeah. Once again, it is unwise to turn off reason because of a dramatic experience.

        And back to Benny Hinn for a moment, he has been proven a liar. There is one specific case where he proclaimed a healing that absolutely did not happen, even temporarily, and the victim had the courage to come forward publically. Benny “healed” a blind boy. Only the poor boy experienced zero improvement in his vision. He went along with things on stage because he was a boy and didn’t know what to do. He has also admitted to an inappropriate extramarital relationship with Paula White, which, were he a man of God truly, would have caused him to step down from public ministry entirely, as it flatly disqualifies him, according to Scripture. A.A. Allen, the other man TB Joshua likes to point out as a predecessor and supporter (how? He’s dead) drank himself to death. The fact that anybody thinks either of these too is a wonderful validation of TBJ’s ministry is highly disturbing.

    • I’m sorry you did not receive what you went for. And I can’t even begin to speculate as to who what where and the why behind…I’d be overstepping my boundaries as only God knows, perhaps the answer lies somewhere in Romans 9:16-23. I simply don’t know, I’m not God. Again, I’m testifying as to what happened to me and what I saw, and what I now know to be true. I won’t question God as to why certain people are healed and others are not, nor why bad things happen to good people, nor will I degrade a doctor who fails to save my mother from dying of cancer when he’s healed others of cancer (at least performed surgery and the following treatments to make someone cancer-free-for example)….at some point in time I have to turn things over to fate and the fact that I’m not in charge, I didn’t create the world, nor do I deserve anything that I have…even down to the very air that I breathe. James 1:17.

      • The difference between your prophet and a doctor is this: The doctor does not claim to be operating by the power of God, and does not make healing incumbent on the patient’s faith in his abilities. IOW: If he fails, he does not blame the patients “lack of faith”.

        If someone is claiming to be operating by the power of the Holy Spirit, there is no room for error in his prophecies. The Holy Spirit doesn’t make mistakes. If a man claims that in the name of Jesus, someone is healed, and they are not healed, *that man is a liar*. Not the person who is sick. The man who claimed that he had healed them, and had not.

      • @ M.,
        Quote “I simply don’t know, I’m not God”
        A common repugnant reply from SCOAN and TB Joshua followers, where they hide behind instead of admitting they are just staging fake healings, deliverances and other claims with other people to move forward their 419 scam deceptions. When you can hide yourself behind such cowardly replies they fob you off by no longer accountable to you.
        The second one repugnant reply is, we don’t have enough faith.
        The third one is blaming our sinful life, I mean who is without sin ?
        The next one is because we attack the god sent “profit” of their local god which resides only in SCOAN Lagos named Emmanuel, God with us as if nobody else has God with them.
        When I use then a derogatory term to express myself as it is, I hope you will understand where I am coming from, not condoning of what I said, but naming as it is, because normal expressions to them is totally and completely immune to them. I can also refer to the words “feaces, dung, excrement and waste products”, because that is what it is. No point beating around the bush is it now ? I what to point out to you that there a videos where TB Joshua also refers to the word sh*t even in his meetings. Just do a search and you will find I am not lying there. As a matter of fact I hate lying and lies overall. Also I hate glossing things over.

  11. Hello authors of this blog,
    Your title should be Prosecutors, those who accuse. Knock yourself on your head and think of what you are doing. Repent from your slanders !!! Your submarine dives in your slander ocean deeper and deeper. You mess yourself in your accusations and slanders to the top of your armpits.

    • Cory, case in point right here. Smelter has provided a wonderful example of the SCOAN tendency to attack ad hominem.
      There is no Scriptural reasoning or defense. There isn’t *any* reasoning at all. Not even at attempt at rebuttal. Just spitting attacks.
      Be careful what you are getting into. The newbies are well-treated until they are thoroughly hooked. But you may find yourself on the receiving end of verbal violence at some point, if you get deeply involved and then unwittingly break some arbitrary rule. Physical violence, even, though I hope your American passport will spare you from that. There have been SCOAN followers here who strongly defended the physical abuse within SCOAN–and yes, to defend it they had to acknowledge it happens–as “It’s OK to slap people in our culture, therefore it’s OK if TBJ or his helpers slap or beat people who are bad.”
      I don’t think you are bad. I don’t think you are stupid. I am sure that you love God. But even good, well-meaning, intelligent, God-loving people can be decieved by a cult. It’s not an insult to say that you have stepped foot into a cult. It’s a warning.

      • Again M, your assumptions in the above posts are too much. First, there were nicer rooms there and better restaurants that I didn’t not experience as a westerner with ‘money’ as you claim. I’ve read James 2, which you keep referring to but you lack the common sense of reserving seating for your guests. If anything, it’s a given that all guests have their seats…and none more important than the other…this scripture that you seem to be really pushing more and more out of context is simple. Treat all the same…which I was. Where is he going to seat 10,000 people? Nigerians SWARM that place because of the things God is doing there….they have to have a system, they have to have reserved seats…can’t you see that? Where do you get quoting James 2 in this manner. All guest are treated well, period. The tents are covered and they all have fans for the guests, and a infant tent for the mothers to play with their children during the services. I’m laughing and your desire to ‘nit-pick’ where people sit in the service. Again, common sense M…if someone is traveling across the world to be a visitor….why wouldn’t they have a spot reserved for them? And here you are complaining that I’m not sitting in one of the overflow tents outside….really? are you really digging that deep and splitting these meaningless hairs? Enough on the preferential treatment…it’s a tiresome argument.
        As for the video you posted above (that has nothing to do with TJBoshua by the way (and moderator…where are the videos I posted? where did they go?, M asked for proof of instant healing right in front of our eyes (although it wasn’t an arm growing back…it was in immediate healing with visual evidence… and I posted 2 videos that gave an example of that and they’re gone….hmmm…but you allow a video that has nothing to do with, nor even mentions TBJoshua on here?) Distance isn’t a barrier….we see that in scripture, don’t we? Of course we do…just listen to the people testimonies who were healed/delivered by watching the tv and praying with TB Joshua…again, more for you to discredit and attack them as people in order to invalidate their own claims (they not TB Joshua, nor SCOAN, they’re normal people just like me with stories of healing and deliverance).
        Moderator, so based on what you wrote above you’re saying ‘some’ of the hearings are fake then…so then some are real? Then by who’s name is he healing people for the ‘real’ ones then? It it God doing the miracles or Satan? Again, if you’re telling me they’re ALL fake, then you’re making a pretty hefty claim that many 10′s of thousands of people are delusional or suffer as victims of the ‘placebo effect’ lol. SCOAN made it clear to me when I asked that they are in favor of clinical evidence of healings….nor do they advice people to quit their medications without clinical evidence. If someone claims that, my response to you is that is not what I saw or heard while there. It was, in fact, the opposite. Why do you think they have so many people came back for their testimonies of healing with medical reports, x-rays and blood tests?…which I’m sure you all believe are staged…that’s okay I can move on. You claim “When you look closer, you see that every aspect of TBJ’s ministry is a counterfeit.” Friend, I have looked closer…like you, I had questions (but still faith). I went, I saw, I believe his to be a true man of God. You claim his prophesies are vague….some are vague and maybe say the month, some are not and name the specific day….but either way all have come to pass.
        I’m sorry to hear the rogue stories that are on this site…I can’t speak to them. I speak to what I see and know to be true based on my firsthand experience.
        His charitable giving ‘trumpet blowing’ as you say?….encouraging and inspiring me to give more to the needy (as he has). Enough said.
        M-basd on the post above it seem that you’re teetering on the edge of paranoia…speaking of what ‘could’ happen to me. Funny, TBJoshua calls out cultists in his service…unexpectedly (one had infiltrated his musician team)…they’re delivered and retsored (brought back to a right relationship with the Lord). Fake? Setup? Scripted? I have a hunch what you’ll say…but regardless…I believe what I see, I believe their testimonies afterward of verifying what TBJ is saying as true. Call me a child, call me naive, call me gullible, but I rest with peace in my childlike faith that TBJoshua is the real deal, he gives all glory to Jesus, and God has indeed anointed him. I’ve seen the evidence and I’m testifying to what I know. I never justified sinning in anyway. I simply said that I can understand how people would react in an overly aggressive way when someone near and dear to them is threatened and I gave examples in which I may do the same.

      • Not nitpicking. You brought up seperate seating. Show no favoritism is a command, not negated by international travel. Once again, I didn’t say the favoritism was about race, nor luxury. If it is as you say it is, then there is no reason international visitors should not find the seats that are available, rather than being given special seating.

        But, I’m sure not too long from now, a video from ETV will pop up, entitled “Famous American Sports Player Healed Instantly!”

        You are still justifying the sinful curses and threats against TBJWatch. NOBODY here has threatened TBJ. There is nothing to “understand” in the curses because they are not even in response to threats. If you think the existence of this blog is a threat, then i’d say you are the paranoid one.

        I’m most definitely not paranoid. TBJ’s influence led to abuse in my houshold. He did not “deliver” my husband who was already a broken and angry person. No matter how many times my husband laid his hands on the screen and prayed along. No matter how loudly he played all that screaming and shrieking. No matter how many people he watched vomiting and pissing themselves on the floor of SCOAN. He became obsessed. HE STOPPED PRAYING WITH US AS A FAMILY AND STOPPED READING HIS BIBLE CONSISTENLY, preferring to stare dumbly at E-TV late into the night. Preferring to take TBJ’s word as if it was God’s Word. He took on the same frightening attitude that you see captured in the post above, except believe you me, it is far more terrifying when the person is shouting curses at you in person, with bulging eyes and barely restraining themselves from hitting you. And it is far more hurtful when it’s a person you know and love is the one calling you a demoniac, and disrespecting the faith of you, your family, and even his family. Frankly that stunned me the most. His father gave his life and health to church planting, but because he is not a TBJ follower, according to my husband, his father “doesn’t know God truly.” Instead of doing the hard work to reconcile our marriage, he has gone to NJ to acquire some annointing water. He “couldn’t afford” to drive 1/2 hr to see his own children, but he can afford a round trip plane ticket to NJ. Do you not see how utterly twisted and cultish this is?

        He demanded that I leave the hospital after he prayed, when I was suffering from pre-ecclampsia with our youngest child. I had no objection to praying. And I believe God did rescue me and the baby from damage from that disease. But believing that, I still wasn’t about to put my child’s life at risk, and have her blood on my hands if the disease progressed and killed her. Because of that, my husband was angry. When I asked him what would happen if I left, and she died, he said “Well, that’s God’s business.” Screw that. I’m a mother with an obligation *from God* to protect my children. And that is what I chose to do. My husband, because of his involvement with TBJ, thinks that makes me a faithless unbeliever. Screw that, too. I know who I believe in. And I know that Jesus Christ who saves me has no problem with me using what’s medically available to address illness. Had I not been firm in my own faith, my daughter and I could well have been two more casualties of TBJ’s dark ministry.

        That’s my experience. My real, true experience. You have yours, I have mine. What TBJ did “for” my family is what drove me to question him. It didnt’ happen the other way around, because I was willing to let things be, even if i wasn’t interested in listening to him. No, I’m sure there is some power involved there. It’s not God’s power. The only thing I can thank TBJ for is that he prompted the crisis I needed to stand up and say “No more.” to the sickness and abuse that was hurting me and my children. He took an already bad situation and made it 100% intolerable. woo-hoo, what amazing work he did, eh? Shall I applaud him? Shall I go to SCOAN and testify to that?

        Again. Believe what you want. But don’t say you weren’t warned. This blog is a watchtower, and yes, we are shouting. But it’s your choice whether to listen or to walk into the mouth of the beast.

  12. Hello you who works against SCOAN,
    It was the group of hypocrites who branded Christ as an imposter and then murdered Him. They witnessed the miracles and they killed Him anyway. Do not you think that you are parrots of those ones today? Repent !!!

  13. @ Mr. Cory,
    We all did what you did. Sleep in the bunk beds, eat that food, sit in front of him and Wisemen. Speak to all of them, their leaders from all the branches, everything what you tell and much more. Interact with many people inside and outside the church. I did see no healing, nor did I experience any healing, even though long time powers came over me and again and again and again and again. Nothing ! Absolute nothing. I checked with my wife, again nothing, I checked with those We stood proxy for on the placards. Again nothing, I checked with my neighbours, again nothing, only to hear they died of cancer and anything they have they work their behind off day and night, some now have Alzheimer’s, hip replacements, divorce, separation, destruction in their families, sickness, set backs that set them back decades, loss of family, arguments with family members, fights, quarrels, throat problems, depression, all being stood proxy for, still sitting in their wheel chairs, heart attacks, herpes out bursts, financial debts, business failures and much more, all sprayed and have been in contact with the so called “anointing waters” and wearing the wristbands, nothing has changed for them, nothing. Of course in your eyes that “see” now that was all made up right ? Sucked out of our thumbs, lied, fabricated stories.
    I was personally on the forefront of it all for many years, going through all their shite, (pardon me), they put in my face and lied through their teeth to me while witnessing them do it while I said nothing and finally turned my back to their scam traps they set up to deceive me, week in week out, with their so called demons of fear, death, Indian man, queen of this and that, demon so and so, darkness, shame, confusion, pornography, spirits of grandad and grandmother, crocodile, snake, monkey, dog, sex addiction, you name it and that were their leaders who stood every week in front of us being pious and full of themselves, trying to impress us they were the ones that were leading us as if they were the ” chose” ones. All of this was made up by me, I was never there, was never involved, yet people came to me crying , sobbing of what their so called “Leaders” did to them. Mind you, I watched them close by, sat literally upon their lips, interacted with them as likely no other did and what did I see ? The exact opposite of what you have seen or claim to see now. But I am just an individual, in their eyes a nobody and worth to tell every lie in the book to me of why things were not happening and more. Who wants to be with such ? So I left and I come occasionally here to confront t people like you, who I believe are just one of those that are sent out to speak even more lies.
    If you believe that he heals people, why is he not like Benny Hinn walking in every hospital and emptying them as they go along. The suffering that you went through for a few years because of sports injuries are nothing compared what I have seen and gone through myself and have seen in others. None of them ever made it, yet still you come with this shite (pardon me) to me of how impressed you are which is no evidence than your words here. If I was standing in front of you I would like and love to smack you in the face because of your lies and disgusting promotion of a mortal human being, because that is why you are here, nothing else. But I would refrain myself from doing so, because nothing that you can ever say to me regarding this waste of my lifetime can change my conviction of what I have seen and gone through with this filth that you promote so much with gusto. One more time for you II Thessalonians 2. Maybe you will read it and understand it one day.
    That includes you Smelter.

    • Jesse, I have called out SCOAN followers on their language, and I want to encourage you to reconsider yours.

      You are rightfully angry at having been decieved. But remember that Cory is not the one you need to be angry at. He is where you one were. Have pity on him and pray for him. No smacking necessary. :)

      Strong debate is a good thing. :) The bitterness, especially directed at someone we know is thoroughly decieved right now, that is not good.

      • M-thanks for the defense but due to the deception I seem to be lost in of being healed and the joy I have of knowing that the Lord used a man to touch and heal me I failed to take offense to Jesse’s comments. My allegiance is with Jesus and his kingdom, not any mortal man. I don’t pray to TBJ nor will I (in my deception as you all claim I am). But I do thank God for showing me what faith to move mountains really looks like.

      • Cory,
        Signs and wonders are NOT a sign that someone is from God the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ!

        Remember what Jesus said:

        True and False Prophets
        15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thorn bushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.
        21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’ Mathew 7: 15-23

        3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”
        4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in My Name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah (or Anointed One),’ and will deceive many – Mathew 24:3-5

        10trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord. 11Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them; 12for it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret.…Ephesians 5:11

      • @ M.,
        I know very well that Benny Hinn does not empty hospitals or mortuaries. I have seen personal law cases from Florida Lawyers against Benny Hinn in where he “knocked” over an 80 year old woman and others who were claimed healed and all died because of “slain in the spirit”. I have seen the paperwork and all that came with it myself and hold them in my hands and went through and read them.
        When I say something I call it by its name. Hope you understand that.

    • Jesse, you did NOT do what I did. I went and receive spiritual deliverance and physical healing. As you mentioned above…you didn’t receive those things. So because God decides to heal people, and not others he’s not God then? Whether through a man like TBJoshua or not….it doesn’t matter. I believe Rom 9 holds your answer to that. You harbor bitterness, and hold to a false belief that everyone ‘should’ be healed. Who made you God to decide who should get healed and who shouldn’t? I deserve NOTHING. All I have I’m grateful for, as every good and perfect gift is from above…even to the very air I breathe…I deserve nothing. If the Lord takes it away then so be it. I had a wonderful 2 mile jog yesterday on pain-free knee for the first time in a decade…it’s real bro…period. I believe…and it became so. I’m not you, nor do I speak for you, but your actions speak of bitterness and entitlement. I pray you don’t take those things to the grave with you as they’ll ultimately be your undoing friend. Please don’t even bring Benny Hinn into this…I’m definitely not defending him…I’m defending TB Joshua and testifying to God healing me through him. TB Joshua will do as the Lord leads, if he tells him to go into a hospital and heal them all then he will. Period.

      • @Cory
        Yep,that “over-zealous way” of threatening and cursing people can be many times found from
        tbjoshuawatch followers as well. To say it is only from TBJ followers is a big lie as you can see.
        Bitterness is their special way to express themselves especially from Mr Terrific,Jamie,Jesse and Justwonder.
        Dear Cory,please leave them alone.you will not achieve at anthing.

      • It is strange that the people who are seriously harmed by TB Joshua and scoan, dont receive any, just any respons of consideration, care or mercy form the pro-scoan-fans. You seem to be the ‘real’ christians, and we are the ‘ enemy” . The facts are, we are seriously harmed by this ministery. In a way that is so sick-making that it takes a while before all pain about it, has come to rest. I have no bitterness to TB. I am in the fase to just have pity on him. A God-man who needs it to hunt, harm, blame,abuse, insult, and only is able to Judge the other for his mistakes and lack of integrity and morality, is a confused man. I pray for TB each day, so he will awake out of his mania. Poor guy believes he has to be treated as more then God.

  14. Also remember what happened to tbj’s previous leaders:

    About al his previous “junior prophets” left him?

    • This is for you TB Joshua,

      A Prophecy Against False Shepherds

      34 The word of the LORD came to me: 2 “Son of man, prophesy against the shepherds of Israel; prophesy, and say to them—to the shepherds: ‘This is what the sovereign LORD says: Woe to the shepherds of Israel who have been feeding themselves! Should not shepherds feed the flock? 3 You eat the fat, you clothe yourselves with the wool, you slaughter the choice animals, but you do not feed the sheep! 4 You have not strengthened the weak, healed the sick, bandaged the injured, brought back the strays, or sought the lost, but with force and harshness you have ruled over them. 5 They were scattered because they had no shepherd, and they became food for every wild beast. 6 My sheep wandered over all the mountains and on every high hill. My sheep were scattered over the entire face of the earth with no one looking or searching for them.
      7 “‘Therefore, you shepherds, hear the word of the LORD: 8 As surely as I live, declares the sovereign LORD, my sheep have become prey and have become food for all the wild beasts. There was no shepherd, and my shepherds did not search for my flock, but fed themselves and did not feed my sheep, 9 Therefore, you shepherds, hear the word of the LORD: 10 This is what the sovereign LORD says: Look, I am against the shepherds, and I will demand my sheep from their hand. I will no longer let them be shepherds; the shepherds will not feed themselves anymore. I will rescue my sheep from their mouth, so that they will no longer be food for them.
      11 “‘For this is what the sovereign LORD says: Look, I myself will search for my sheep and seek them out. 12 As a shepherd seeks out his flock when he is among his scattered sheep, so I will seek out my flock. I will rescue them from all the places where they have been scattered on a cloudy, dark day. 13 I will bring them out from among the peoples and gather them from foreign countries; I will bring them to their own land. I will feed them on the mountains of Israel, by the streams and all the inhabited places of the land. 14 In a good pasture I will feed them; the mountain heights of Israel will be their pasture. There they will lie down in a lush pasture, and they will feed on rich grass on the mountains of Israel. 15 I myself will feed my sheep and I myself will make them lie down, declares the sovereign LORD. 16 I will seek the lost and bring back the strays; I will bandage the injured and strengthen the sick, but the fat and the strong I will destroy. I will feed them—with judgment! Ezekiel 34

      • Remember tbj:

        One has been ‘dropped’ already?

        Ikabod – “The glory has departed”
        This is what the LORD Almighty says:
        “The people of God are oppressed by TB Joshua and his wise men. All their captors (TB Joshua and his wise men) hold them (the disciples) fast, refusing to let them go. Jer 50:33
        Yet their Redeemer is strong, the Lord Almighty is His Name.
        He will vigorously defend their causes, so that He may bring rest to their land, but unrest to those who live in Babylon (scoan). Jer 50:34
        A sword against the Babylonians, TB Joshua and his wise men!
        Declares the Lord-

        1. Against those who live in Babylon and
        2. Against her officials and
        3. Against their wise men and
        4. A sword against her false prophet
        THEY WILL BECOME FOOLS – Jer 50:35

      • Just wonder, I can play the scripture game with you too, this is more fitting.
        29 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous. 30 And you say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our ancestors, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31 So you testify against yourselves that you are the descendants of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Go ahead, then, and complete what your ancestors started!
        33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34 Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35 And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation.
        37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate. 39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’[c]”

    • Wonderful Just Wonder….where’s the video of him later??? Where he apologizes to TBJoshua and the wiremen for his slander…I’d post that as a response to this but I have a feeling the moderator wouldn’t allow it as what has happened in my other videos….

      • Oh, you mean after he was humiliated and threatened?

        You don’t seem to have the first clue about cult dynamics at all.

    • This is an old video and outdated…where’s the newer video of this same man apologizing for his comments and slandering TBJoshua…in which wiseman Daniel is there to moderate and confirm? That’s out there too…I’d post it but I have a feeling it wouldn’t make it on here….

      • We haven’t intentionally removed any videos, but I did think it seemed like you meant to post one in one of your comments. If that was our fault, we apologise. It was unintentional. Post anything you like if it’s relevant to the discussion.

  15. Cory, Agomo never apologized after his leaving scoan. The video that was sended-out by TB is an old video about Agomos arriving in scoan. TB records all the confessions and testemonies of people in scoan, and he will use them against them if they come out with un-populair informations about TB. Cory, there are healings in scoan,. In my country there is a professor in theology, whoes grandchild became healed from deafness. This man at the same time, had to counsel 3 young women, who where discipled by TB and became seksual abused, and more. He finally decided to breack his connection with TB. The powers of TB can be used for the good and the worse. For God-ordained purposes and for own gain. You must have some questions about your visit in scoan, other-wise you would not be on this site.

    • He did apologize for his statement and asks for forgiveness the first time he left scoan, then was re-admitted/forgiven, then left again a second time. This is the video I was referring to, is clearly shows all of the drama wife his arrival, then leaving, his apology, his re-accpetance, his leaving again (and the video you mention above) but more importantly in shows the people he’s referring to in his video you posted and blatantly demising all of his claims as false. Again, you can claim TBJoshua is a fake…go right ahead. But our the thousands of stories fake also, are we all liars? Agamoh’s lies are revealed by the actual people he used to verify his claims…justice is served.

  16. M-it’s clear you don’t understand the concept of reserved seating and the common sense that folks traveling across the world should be guaranteed a seat…and not left to ‘fend for themselves’…really…can we move on please? …of course…Nor should the elderly have a section?, the hearing impaired, the nursing mothers?….hypocrisy.
    Again, your the queen of assumptions…who said I “think the existence of this blog is a threat” as you claim? Surely not me.
    Thanks for shedding light on your situation at home. I’m sorry of the situation with your husband. There’s obviously much more going on there. But I ALSO see how now you’ve used TBJoshua as your scapegoat for your husbands actions. Again, I’m sorry he touched the screen and wasn’t healed (see my statements above on that topic). So all of the pain and suffering in your family is TB Joshua’s fault? really? Last time I checked we’re accountable for our own sins…period (no matter how great or small were wronged by others). And from what you’ve revealed, your husband had some serious problems before ‘trying out’ TBJoshua…that’s what led him to start watching the channel and touching the screen?….I see your responses are led by your emotions and lack of reason. Regardless of what TBJoshua does or doesn’t do to your husband and his pursuit of self-control and anger management….I pray that your family will be healed that the enemies stronghold in his life will be broken and you will ended see marital peace. I don’t know you but trust me, I want that for you. But I would encourage you not to use TBJoshua as your ‘scapegoat’. You blame your husbands fits of rage/anger on TB Joshua? You blame your husbands lack of praying with you and reading his bible on TB Joshua?…hmmm. And, I’m the one being accused of being ‘obsessed’ with TBJoshua, yet ironically that is exactly what you describe your husband as…based on your post above. There it is.
    You ask “Do you not see how utterly twisted and cultish this is?”…you’ve shown me how dangerous it is to be utterly twisted and obsessed (to a level of cultish behavior) as your husband was with TBJoshua. TBJ is not God, Jesus, or the Holy Spirit…but TBJoshua points people to God and glorifies Jesus and Lord of all. I’m a believer in TB Joshua, and that’s my story and I’m sticking to it. I’ll continue to rest in peace in my ‘wacky’ belief that God would mightily empower a Nigerian man who used to wash the toilets with his bare hands and labor endlessly building the church from scratch that numbers in the 10′s of thousands today.
    And thanks for admitting it, you believe ‘there’s power’ as you say…but ‘not from God’?. Okay, then…so Satan healed my knees (and the thousands of others who have stories just like mine)?….so I’m giving glory to Jesus Christ (and so does TBJoshua) for my healing that Satan actually performed on me? Matthew 12:22-30
    22 Then they brought him a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute, and Jesus healed him, so that he could both talk and see. 23 All the people were astonished and said, “Could this be the Son of David?”
    24 But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “It is only by Beelzebul, the prince of demons, that this fellow drives out demons.”
    25 Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them, “Every kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand. 26 If Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then can his kingdom stand? 27 And if I drive out demons by Beelzebul, by whom do your people drive them out? So then, they will be your judges. 28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I drive out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
    29 “Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can plunder his house.
    30 “Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.

    • “Again, your the queen of assumptions…who said I “think the existence of this blog is a threat” as you claim? Surely not me”
      That’s how you justify the violent cursing from SCOAN followers. You say you “understand” their violence directed at people who “threaten” TBJ. Once again, no threats have been made against TBJ by this blog or the commenters. Those comments were not made in response to threats, but to simple disagreement on doctrine. Therefore, there is nothing for you to “understand” in the cursing by his defenders. Just out with it and call it the sin that it is, OK? You won’t be so understanding on the day they direct their vile words against you. And if the experiences recounted on this blog are anything to go by, that day may well come.
      You are making the assumption that TBJ is a scapegoat to me, and that is incorrect. You may note that I did not say he caused my husband’s issues, or our marital troubles. Those existed before youtube existed. However, the cultic nature of his teaching fed right into my husband’s vulnerabilities, and rather than “delivering” him, worsened them. My husband didn’t learn love and humility from TBJ. He learned that you fix problems by screaming violently at the “demons” in all the people and things around you. He didn’t learn to humble himself and put effort into repairing wrongs. He learned that an expensive bottle of tap water, if applied with the right prayers (preferably screamed, repetetively), will fix his marriage. He learned that marital strife is not because two people are failing to love and compromise and care for each other, but that it is because one or both are demonized. He learned that I was not unhappy with him because he was selfish, mean, abusive, and terrorizing our children, but that my unhappiness was caused by me having a demon. No, TBJ didn’t cause our issues. He just provided a fine, sturdy framework on which my husband could build spiritual-sounding justifications for his sin. TBJ claims that distance is not a barrier, and that deliverance can be had by touching the screen. His claims are what condemn him, because they fail, time and again. If he was not making such claims, and the claims about the water, etc, there would be much less to confront him on. But since he pridefully and publically makes these claims CONSTANTLY, you can bet he’s going to get called out on it. My husband is a believer above all believers in TBJ. He despises all other churches as “dead”. He’s “proven” his belief by giving hundreds of dollars to SCOAN while telling me we didn’t have money to make basic repairs at home. He meets all the requirements for getting what TBJ offers, and yet he didn’t.
      When TBJ stops making prideful, public claims of his powers, I will stop publically addressing the wrong he’s doing.

    • There’s a class of people you don’t even seem to consider. That’s the class of poor Africans (mainly) who have spent their last savings getting to Lagos, only to be refused entry to the church. Hundreds suffer this every week.

      • I understand that for sure. Think about it…thousands of people flock to this place every week from all over the world. Just like they did to Jesus, Peter and Paul back in the days hoping to be healed….and many many were. But there’s soo many hurting people out there, disabled, on their last leg, poor, or whatever…that would do ‘anything in their means’ to even touch TBJoshua. The church would easily become overwhelmed with people breaking down the doors, storming the grounds rushing in demanding TBJoshua to heal them…mass chaos/riots/who knows what would happen but it wouldn’t be good. There’s got to be some sort of organization and order in the process. As many of the thousands of local Nigerians that have been healed, delivered, and helped financially at SCOAN…I know there’s many who have not, and who will never be healed…’the poor you always have around’. And as many that are flocking, climbing the gates to get in to be healed, there’s many local Nigerians who believe the same thing you guys do…that he’s a fake, and they want to take TBJoshua out. There needs to be a system in place for those needing healing in an organized manner and protection from those who have come to snuff TBJoshua out. They’re pretty straightforward on their instructions in not to come visit without going through the application process and receiving an invitation letter. Don’t just show up.

      • I LOVE 2 THESS 2!!! But unfortunately it has absolutely nothing to do with the topic we’re on…you’ve taken it out of context. V.2 gives you the the reasons Paul is writing it…people are teaching that Jesus has already come and gone (the second time)…and the rest of the chapter Paul elaborates. Sorry, NOTHING to do with TBJ as he’s never proclaimed that nor will he. TBJ stated in this video “Jesus is alive” and “He will be with us until the end of the age”. I humored you on your Thess 2 chapter Jesse, now humor me on my request…watch this 4.5 min video.

      • @ Cory,

        Quote “you’ve taken it out of context”

        That is a famous expression that everyone likes to say, when it does not come convenient to them.

        Verse 3 shows what this text is about. Do not be deceived by what ? Any man, especially mortal men like TB Joshua who claims he is infallible because the Holy Spirit lives in him. Really ?

        1 John 1:8-10
        If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

        When he lies and claims that about himself, how much more a liar is he then. What does the Bible say then ?

        Are you saying then that he is Jesus ? As in these Scriptures …John 8:44-45
        Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:for he is a liar, and the father of it. 45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

        Did TB Joshua speak the truth when he claims he is infallible because whatever he says is truth as well his followers claim, including you ? Only Jesus can say this, but TB Joshua, no. Evidence is also in John Chi who was claimed he “received” the Holy Spirit and yet fell, because it was said “Don’t tempt the Devil to tempt you ”

        Cory, when you really figure out who you are following, let me know, but so far I have not seen Jesus in Lagos as you claim and others He is there. FYI, Jesus sits at the Right Hand of God and we are here with the Holy Spirit, Who encompasses the entire world and universes, FYI and works through all Creation. So there you are, I said it, I hope you can accept that as the Absolute Truth, because that is so. And I am telling you now, the Holy Spirit does not reside in Lagos only or in the branches of SCOAN. He is Omnipresent, Omniscient and Omnipotent. He knows what I write now and will write in the future.

  17. @Cory,
    Scripture for Scripture: Matthew 24:22 and onward.
    22 “If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time.
    26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.
    Now, you thankfully acknowledge that TBJ is not Jesus. Praise God. But you must surely be aware of the Messianic claims made by some of his followers. If not, best to check that out. “The messiah of this age” and “The prophet of this generation” are common labels applied to him. And according to Jesus, we should expect these, and be wary of them. Because they are clever enough to decieve even believers.
    Matthew 7:21…21″Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. 22″Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’ 23″And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.’
    Again, the very words of Jesus Christ indicate that there are and will be some decievers who perform signs and wonders in his name, who ARE NOT HIS.
    The Scripture you referenced is Jesus talking about HIMSELF.Jesus Christ, the son of God, God-with-us, the TRUE Emmanuel, was being accused of operating by the power of Satan. Being the Messiah, obviously that was not true. That is the context of the Scripture. As you acknowledged TBJ is not Jesus, then it is inappropriate to apply that Scripture to TBJ, as if it were talking about him. That Scripture is not a blanket approval of all men who claim to preach and use the name of Jesus. Unless you also would like to use it to approve of Jim Jones.

    • I’ll repeat, you say ‘some’ of his miracles are real…and the rest are fake, ok…You said it. Then you said they’re ‘not of God’…these aren’t my words….they’re yours. So then TBJoshua is doing these miracles, healings, deliverances, prophesies by Satan then? Right?…I’m just using your own words and reasoning with you. As Jesus puts it (which is why I posted what I posted, a miracle is a miracle, it’s not about the person performing as much as it is the one doing miracle through someone)…how can Satan drive our Satan?….obviously he can’t as Jesus teaches us. M-I’m simply using the same argument that Jesus used. People are healed (I can attest to that and so can they), people are delivered (I can attest to that and so can they), and hidden truths are revealed (I can attest to that and so can they)….that’s all I can say M. If YOU believe he’s false…and we’re all either wacko for believing he’s REAL and we’re just ‘imaging’ our healings…then so be it. This man is indeed a prophet on a biblical scale…the blind see, the lame walk, the deaf hear, and peoples hidden lives are revealed to him by God (for His glory, not TBJoshuas). And no, it’s not by Satan that he’s doing all this…as we all know Satan’s mission is to kill, steal and destroy…and the items I listed are characteristics of God, not of Satan. My bottom line: TB Joshua claims to be a prophet and guess what?…HE BACKS IT UP by his actions, his goodwill, his teachings, his elevating of Jesus above all. He’s not the messiah, nor does he claim to be. I’m not talking about Benny Hinn of Jim Jones or anyone else. I’m talking about TBJoshua and what I know. I attest that he’s not FAKE, but a TRUE man of God…period. At this point, I’m at peace with putting this issue to rest. I won’t be able to convince you and you won’t be able to convince me otherwise. We’ve both said out peace (I think). I’ll rest with the other 920,000 Facebook people who feel as I do and you can rest in the 1,500 or so that feel as you do. I have peace with that.

      • We’ve not said any are “real”, they’re all fake, but fake doesn’t mean that they don’t work. If I pay for something with a counterfeit coin and the coin is accepted, then that coin worked, but it doesn’t make it real. Perhaps to be more clear I should say they are not fake miracles, they are fake miracles of God. Perhaps that distinction helps.

      • As for the biblical scale prophet, now you’re getting ridiculous! Have you watched his vague world prophecies? That’s not prophecy, it’s stating the obvious! Have you seen how he edits out mistakes in his prophecies? Seriously, his prophetic ministry is laughable, he’s just making a fool out of himself.

      • So basically, Cory, you’re saying you’re OK with being a lemming? Do we not have a million examples in history of how foolish it is to say something is truth “Because look how many people agree!”? Seriously?

    • Cory,
      Being a wealthy American, tbj will use you until you mean nothing to him and his ministry anymore and then you will be ‘dropped’. Just like one of his five ‘wise men’. New testimony. And by the way – there are many new posts on this blog, should you care to read them. The reason he seems nice to you, is because you are a wealthy American. If you where poor he would not even notice you. And he will continue to seem nice, until you lose you wealth. Only then will you see his true colors. He drops you, when you need him the most – that is what has happened to most people that are writing on this blog. Most believed he was a real man of god, in the beginning. And now feel that they must warn new comers like you, so that you will not step into the same trap.

      That DVD is just the proof of how low tbj is and how you do not know anything about him. To stoop so low as to use Agomo’s confession against him is sick. Agomo made the DVD, because he was hurt and disillusioned in tbj. The right thing for tbj, the ‘prophet’ to have done, was to reach out and reconcile with him. But he did exactly the opposite. Tbj released a video attacking Agomo’s character, when he himself preaches that Jesus does not bother accusers. And do you really think Jesus would have attacked his disciple in public like that? And one of the ‘junior prophets’ on that video commenting at that time, has also been cut out, after she left him, because of sexual abuse.

      Should tbj be a prophet, those Bible verses might have touched me, but unfortunately he has proofed himself a false prophet of the last days. Over and over again.

      He is the ‘man of god’, with the character of the devil.

      But do not let us stop you from believing what you are believing. Maybe you deserve a’ prophet’ like that.

      • How will I be ‘dropped’? I didn’t know he picked me up…I didn’t know I was following him? I’m following Jesus. Again, I don’t pray to TBJ, nor do I ask him for forgiveness. What do I mean to his ministry anyway?…I’m of no financial value to his ministry. All I have is my own personal story of healing…That’s all I got. What good is that to a money-hungry, prideful, attention seeking-person like him, right? hmmm? Your accusation of him ‘using’ me just doesn’t line up. I’ve got nothing that would be ‘used’ by him….of course, if he’s the man you say he is anyway. You say “If you where poor he would not even notice you.” Funny, hmmm….I spent 2-3 hours watching him heal, deliver, and financially support the local poor Nigerian population on Saturday. Quite the opposite of your claims as a man who cares nothing for the poor, non-americans wouldn’t you say? Paul A’s testimony speaks for itself…he came in dirt poor, SCOAN loved him and took care of him…he left an started the accusations, THEN he repents, asks for forgiveness, and they take him back, THEN he bails again and starts the accusations again…THEN the very same people he uses in his argument against SCOAN speak out against him that he’s lying….that dude is about as stable as the stock market during a war….seriously. Paul A’s own testimony condemned him…and the testimony of the people he brought in his argument. I’m not condemning him.

  18. @ All,
    I don’t want to use any language that is derogatory. And I am well aware and very much known with certain scriptures such as:
    A wholesome tongue is a tree of life: but perverseness therein is a breach in the spirit.
    And
    Let no evil talk come out of your mouth, but only what is good for giving necessary teaching, and for grace to those who give ear.
    But when you see something that is as they are, you call it as it is.
    Cory is just another person or same person over and over again in the nasty TB Joshua league that come online to spit out their lies and the promotion of a person they so admire because of gain they get out of it all.
    I am well aware when I say things as I say, perhaps if someone want to so called categorise this under “over zealousness” which is again something that is coming from them as telling it is only in their interest how they can expand their personal agenda to keep on lying and deceiving.
    I am of opinion when you call it as it is, you speak the truth, which they can’t handle and go over into telling how it supposed to be to others but not to themselves. They never do anything wrong themselves, pah ! As it is, they are willingly and deliberately beyond correction because they think they are or keep telling themselves they are. But not in my book or experience with them personally as I have gone through with them. If they would get a smack in their face, they just would deserve it because of their evil selfish manipulative attitudes, which does not root in Gods Spirit, but in Satanic core manipulations to subdue you to their false selfish demonic authority.
    One last thing. To Cory, about my so called “deliverance” quotation of yours. Why is it after being involved for over 30 years into the many charismatic circles and largest (charismatic) churches in the world including TB Joshua’s branches and church as well Lagos he and all others have been incapable to “deliver” me for over 30 years ! To me apparently and many others there is nothing to deliver then is it now. When you stop talking bull, let me know it, thank you.
    PS, I have challenged the entire SCOAN including TB Joshua and Wiseman, if “Distance is not a barrier claim” prove your prowess of their claimed “remote deliverance and healing” and if they speak to God, Jesus and Holy Spirit as they claim on a daily basis, it would have happened already. Would it not ? But don’t ask me to hold my breath on that one, otherwise I would have been dead already. Long time. Again for you II Thessalonians 2. Thank you.

    • Jesse, you call TBJoshua a wolf in sheeps clothing…but I hear you say things in the above statement where you justify slander, name calling, and defamations of character to name a few…(and using scripture!!!) But you ignore James 4:11 in order to approve of your sin? You say , “I don’t want to use any language that is derogatory”, then you quote scriptures (loosely) and then you say, “But when you see something that is as they are, you call it as it is.” Jesse, I’m not condemning you, your actions have done that yourself. You own testimony against yourself will condemn you…not me. Example, I don’t agree with everything Obama does…It makes me sick in my stomach to think that my tax dollars are paying for late-term abortions where babies full-developed arms, legs, and heads are being pulled out of a mothers womb just before the baby could’ve been born naturally. I’m using this graphic analogy to show how important this is to me and how strongly I feel about this wrong doing. However, regardless of how vehemently opposed I am to this hideous act…I will not willingly walk into sin myself. What good is it, and how does it glorify God to draw me into sinning in my response to someone else’s sin? My encouragement is that whatever you think of TBJoshua, for the good of your own soul, you cease with the name-calling, check your emotions at the door, regardless of your experiences in the past, and get right with God. TB Joshua isn’t God, and, despite your claims, he doesn’t claim to be either.
      -I’m new to this blog, sharing my own personal experience.
      -I get no gain
      -Are you saying you’re not delivered? I’m just not sure what your statement means…
      -As I said before many folks have testimonies of miraculous things happening from the ‘distance is not a barrier claim’, I’d show you the videos but you’ll say they’re fake I’m sure.

  19. @ All,
    If anyone got “demons” especially their leaders, they contracted them in SCOAN nowhere else. The rest is being ridden by their transference of ” demons ” they dispense themselves inside SCOAN and the branches.
    Revelation 18:2
    Darby Translation (DARBY)
    2 And he cried with a strong voice, saying, Great Babylon has fallen, has fallen, and has become the HABITATION of demons, and a HOLD of every unclean spirit, and a HOLD of every unclean and hated bird;

    • Yes, this is one of the scariest things about SCOAN. Seeing people you knew who were sane, normal, healthy people before going to SCOAN, then manfesting demons on the prayer line after years in TBJ’s ministry. From this you either have to conclude that it’s all an act, or SCOAN is a serious danger to your spiritual life. Cory, beware.

  20. tbjoshuawatch, so I’m trying to make sense of what you’re saying. The miracles happen, but there counterfeit? You say, “They’re not fake miracles (so they’re real?), they’re fake miracles of God”. So are you saying that the healings do happen, they’re just not of God? I think that’s what I’m hearing you say (correct me if I’m wrong). But that leaves us in a pinch, see my Satan arguments above (Matt 12). If God’s not doing the miracles, then Satan must me. These healings are happening, with validated testimonies, x-rays, blood tests, to prove…but it’s all of Satan??? Lives are touched, physical disabilities are being healed, marriages are being mended, the poor are given money, shelter, and food, shelters are being built, medical clinics are being erected (like the one in Haiti that SCOAN built), and it’s all in the name of SATAN? I’m giggling just typing this friends, really….who’s being ‘ridiculous’? Hmmm…c’mon…There’s disbelief and then there’s flat out denial…I think we’re teetering on the latter.

    • To Cory,
      Lol –-do you really believe everything tbj puts on emman TV? Did you do your research well? Have you got proof, other than what they show on TV, that what he shows is really happening? Dude – nothing is going on in Haiti and very little anywhere else. Just his offshore bank accounts are growing. Many of these things on TV are just eye wash and never reach their destinations. He is just parading these people around on TV, to play on people’s emotion, so that they will give him money to line his own bank accounts. You just know too much for a onetime visitor from America? You very much sound like one of scoan’s insiders trying to defend him.

      • Just Wonder,
        Yes, I do. It’s called “faith to move mountains”…when I returned back to american from my time at SCOAN I wept bitterly in remorse for my previous lack of faith…the kind that moves mountains. That’s MY testimony. My faith has increased exponentially because of the experiences I had as SCOAN. God is good and gracious and redeeming.

        You ask for Proof? I have a feeling your skepticism will be your undoing (if it already haven’t yet) friend. Guessing that you’re one of those people who read something and then say…”no wayyy, I gotta see it”. Then, you’re shown the video of it then you say…”no wayyy, I gotta talk to them myself”. Then, you talk to them yourself and then you say…”no wayy, I wanna see the spot on your body that was healed”. Then they show you the spot (or whatever) was healed on their body and then you say…”no wayyy, I wanna talk to the doctor to verify it”. Then, you talk to the doctor to verify it then you say, “no wayy, show me the X-rays”. You’re shown the X-rays, and then you’re left in desperation, held captive by your lack of faith as your ‘demands’ have been met one by you reap more and more unbelief on your own heart and are stuck in a rut that only grows more bitter and bitter over time…obsessed with supporting your lack of faith by harboring some form of pride (or something of that category) in you that call other people ‘gullible’ or ‘lemmings’ like folks have done here. One thing Thomas had going for him was at least he finally believed when he saw. I can show you the physical healing right in front of your face (from unedited video)…you can hear the peoples testimonies yourself (just like I gave mine), you can see X-rays/bloodtests/clinical release letter/whatever you want to see, but I can’t make you believe. That’s on you friend.

        What do you mean I “know too much”?…I went there for a week, done my investigating, watched many videos, read MANY accusations and heard many nay-sayers of SCOAN and TB Joshua. I’m here to testify that he IS an anointed man who heals many (including myself), gives prophesy (some vague, some specific…but ALL have came to pass), gives TREMENDOUSLY to the poor and needy, and gives all glory to Jesus Chris…not himself…period. I believe.

      • So we should just let Haiti be in the hands of Satan where he (satan) can have his way with the people there through stealing, killing, destroying??? Doesn’t sound like something Jesus would say Jesse.

      • It’s always entertaining when supporters of SCOAN bring up Haiti as an example of TB Joshua’s charity work, because in fact that’s one of their greatest scandals. At the time, they had a huge charity drive, huge amounts of money were raised and TBJ claimed they would open a clinic and orphanage, and were committed to Haiti for the long term. A team went out, and after a matter of weeks they were gone again, leaving nothing except questions about where all the donations went…

      • Even in a Witchdoctor paradise, voo-doo stricken place like Haiti…that power is no match for True and Mighty power of Jesus…this gentleman had been a witchdoctor for all of his life (he’s 80 years old)….he had great power in his field, to kill and curse others…watch what happens. I was there the next Sunday to hear his testimony in person.

      • @ Cory,

        Then get up and go Cory to Haiti and tell them what Jesus really does say according to you. Make sure you show them your knees as well. No pun intended. Just tell them also why TB Joshua left them all to their own devices, since nothing has changed there in their beliefs.

  21. @ Just Wonder,

    Quote ” you very much sound like…..”

    Precisely, have we seen this not before ? We all have, especially when you watch the sentence constructions and certain expressions. Like Hmmmm and trying the efforts of SCOAN justifying as it does come from God and why they refuse to read II Thessalonians 2 and apply that to SCOAN as it is. If we are in the latter last days, we should not be surprise that Satan indeed is very capable to do healing and transfer his demons around in people and command them to keep quiet inside them until the time comes to let them outburst all over the globe and destroy those and loose their salvation that were before inside SCOAN and have been infected with them. Why you think TB Joshua is so frantically wants to let come people to his ministry and refuse to go outside now in unknown territory as Jesus did all over Israel. Simply because he is going to found out he is counterfeit after all. An all important question should be asked again and again. Why would God pick out one person among billions of people and express Himself 24/7. I have been to no ministry ever that that is the case. And I have been to many. Why would Lagos be any different. The only answer is that a big amount of the ” miracles” are fabricated, which expresses itself in the secretive attitudes of their leaders, disciples and followers of this ministry.

    I do not see Jesus hide anything from us, He was very transparent in all He did and clear from Who He got His Revelation and ways of doing. One of the stick horses that TB Joshua followers have is trying to blackmail us as being Pharisees and Sadducees, while nobody on the team in TB Joshua Watch denies the Power of God, including myself and all that is possible with God. True Pharisees and Sadducees did believe in any of that or applied. I mean, I pray when I want to converse with God, I lay hands on sicknesses, I speak if I have a word of knowledge about people, there are miraculous things happening over night or even instantly and I do believe in prophecy, healing, deliverance but not as it too common in one place. If I know that the Holy Spirit moves all the time all over the world a, I denying God doing something ? But the fact that named in my former posts which I checked with others who were involved and being exposed to the powers that TB Joshua expresses one way or another did do nothing for them. They are still sick, still with heart attacks, pain in their ankles, knees, hips, intestine, or have bunion toes and varicose veins, wearing glasses, cancer, wheel chairs, you name it while they show others with much worse conditions on Emmanuel TV , for them it is still the same, even when they went 20 times to Lagos and emptied their wallets to the secretary of monies. Them telling us how they look after the poor…. And more blah blah, ermmm from who are the monies in the first place ? And so forth. Everybody would be at my door if I give away freebies from somebody else that did not generate it themselves than hanging up stark stories in a crowd that blindfolded follows every whim without checking themselves they say. This is not new, it is well known everywhere. Yet still people are gullible enough to be cheated out of their last penny or dime. Just look at the palace of Ghadaffi and now in Kiev the former Prime Minister of Ukraine Viktor F. Yanukovych. Scam artists always tell you they are living poorly, but still rip you off to the last nail you scratch your bottom with. You only have to look at the dress code of Mr TB Joshua and Wisemen. Every week something new. Elaborate as a word comes up. Thank you.

    • Jesse, your reason is just way out in left field. Think about this RATIONALLY….is SATAN healing us then? REALLY? You say, “we should not be surprise that Satan indeed is very capable to do healing and transfer his demons around in people and command them to keep quiet inside them until the time comes”. Wow, so Satan wants me to feel better? Satan wants me to be happy in my pain-free knees? Satan wants marriages mended, the lame to walk, and the blind to see? I’m literally chuckling right now at your accusations. I responded to your misuse of 2 Thess earlier, but not you’re simply completely taking that MISSION of satan (AS SCRIPTURE DEFINES IT) and throwing it out the window. I’m healed, and so are thousands of other…we give ALL praise and glory to Jesus Chris, the author and perfecter of our faith. Now c’mon Jesse, does that sound like something Satan would want?

      By your confession, “Satan indeed is very capable to do healing”…okay so you say the healing are real….but you just say that Satan is doing them them? As least we’re getting somewhere…there is on stronger rebuke to you claims than what is found is Jesus’s words in Matthew 12:22-30. Humor me please Jesse.

      • @ Cory,

        Yes, there are tons of places where Satan heals, fixes marriages, and much more why don’t you research it. Do I have to google that also for you ? Or do I have to take you by the hand and show you ?

        What you err into is that you were learned that Satan is the cause of everything bad, only for you to have forgotten that he was the covering cherub in the garden of Eden and his task was to look after the created world by God as it was then. There are millions of people who are not Christians who are extremely “blessed” and who have sold their souls to Satan and it goes before them extremely well. Just look around in the celebrity world and business world. Most of them are non Christians. Examples, Warren Buffett, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Carlos Slim, Larry Ellison, Amancio Ortega, Jeff Bezos, George Soros, Michael Dell, Mark Zuckerberg, etc. etc. most of them are non believers or even atheists. Do you see them coming for deliverance or healing in Lagos ? NO !

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_atheists_(miscellaneous)

  22. @

    This is what happens when a man claims he is transferring the “lightening of god” as they claim in SCOAN, the long term effect will be flies that come for your spiritless carcass.

  23. A God-man in my country, told me, that his one-hour-tv-show a week, costed him tons of $$ !? Just sending-out one hour a week, costed him 20.000 $ . What amount of money is nessecary to keep emm-tv going for 24 hours a day?

  24. “So basically, Cory, you’re saying you’re OK with being a lemming? Do we not have a million examples in history of how foolish it is to say something is truth “Because look how many people agree!”? Seriously?

    Jesse says:
    February 25, 2014 at 2:35 pm
    @ M.,

    I like the Lemming comparison. +1

    Let me post a lemming video perhaps Cory will wake up.

    http://youtu.be/AOOs8MaR1YM <~~~~~~~ Click here @ Cory if you dare."

    Jesse and M….I'll speak in parables with hopes that you'll understand reason.

    I'm driving down a highway and I pass 1,500 people (the same 1,500 people that like your TBjoshuawatch Facebook page) and they tell me that I better stop driving because the bridge is out ahead. But then I pass another 920,000 people (the same 920,000 people that like TBJoshuas Facebook page) that tell me that the bridge ISN'T out ahead and it's intact. So based in that information alone, I decide to keep driving…and behold I get to the bridge and SEE IT MYSELF that it is INFACT there and intact…proven by 920,000 other people and more importantly MY OWN EYES. Game over. So perhaps that bit of practical reasoning has shed light on your humorously desperate lemming claim.

    • You’re naivety is frightening. History shows many examples of a small number of truth speakers going up against the corrupt masses. As the saying goes, those who don’t know history are doomed to repeat it. :-(

      • It’s not naivety, it’s reason. Christians are always accused of checking their brain in at the door by atheists. In this case, your accusing me of being ‘naive’…which is defined as gullible, inexperienced, immature to name a few. You could make that claim IF I never received any healing, never heard others stories, never saw these claims SCOAN makes for myself, in the flesh. Then, perhaps, you’d have a little bit more room to accuse me of being naive. But nay-sayers, friends, fellow-christians…I have heard the claims, saw the videos, pursued in both doubt and faith, and have seen, tasted and experienced this for myself. I’m blessed because I saw and believed but even more blessed are the ones who believe SCOAN and TBJoshua are real and of God, who haven’t seen for themselves. John 20:29. I’ll take my childlike-faith (you call it naivety) and rest what I know to be true. Matt 18:3

      • @ Cory,

        Funny that people like you always experience something. I know of tons of people who went and came home empty handed. So much for “Emmanuel, God is with us”. If God would be there as in Jesus’ Time, all would be healed as Scripture proves. Yet many come back with nothing. It’s always the Africans that something happens and some whites who are connected with the ministry. I have spent a part of my life there, with nothing to look back upon than nasty experiences, lies, excuses and lame scam techniques. Why would I come there ever again ? Wasting more time of my short life ? I am saying this again. Go ask those that were there for 10 years and over how it is with their varicose veins, bad ankles, bunion toes, lost their jobs, still sitting in their wheel chairs, massive basketball size fibroids, lost their cars, still wearing glasses, families that never reconcile, children that are still autistic, children that died, families that died after visiting there and claimed healed, bubbles on their head, junior prophets that left, church branches that are dysfunctional. Of course it is always the devil that caused all that. How insane and ludicrous. When will people take responsibility for their own actions for once, which is usually the source of their problems and it has nothing to do with demons, but their own choices of foolishness and being an ignoramus.

        But it is always great when you can hide yourself by saying in front of everybody and whining, “the Devil made me do it.” “I blame him for my unfortunate problems”, while I was living foolish and destructive to my own self and refused to live what God wanted and prescribed for me.

      • @ Cory,

        What makes you think we are NOT blessed and more blessed ? Surely you would say that Joni Eareckson-Tada is not blessed because she is not healed and out of her wheelchair, right ? Why did you never write a letter to her and told about in Lagos there is Emmanuel, God with us ? Surely she would book her journey tomorrow, only to come away not healed because TB Joshua will say something in the trend of “I know the Healer, His Name is Jesus Christ, NEVER A SICKNESS Jesus cannot heal” and Mrs Joni will come and go same way as she was. No healing. 100% sure. Hiding behind clever theatrics and sleight of hand and deception.

      • Cory,
        …….“faith to move mountains”…that was just my down fall in scoan Cory. My faith was also sky rocked after I experienced all the miracles and healing etc. I was so excited to think that this is what happened in the Bible time and that it is still happening today. I even thought tbj was equal to Elijah?!?! I had so much blind faith that tbj was the true thing – I mean prophet. But after I found out that he was not the sheep/ram I thought, but a wolf in the skin of a sheep, I was shocked. I am trying to warn you.

        JESUS HIMSELF WARNED US:
        That the false prophets of the last days will be able to
        1. Prophecy in the Name of Jesus
        2. Drive demons out
        3. And in your Name perform many miracles

        BUT

        Jesus will say to them: ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you EVILDOERS!’ Mathew 7:21-23
        I am not talking about the miracle healing etc that supposedly happen in scoan.
        I am talking about tbj as an EVILDOER, the guy’s character. His mannerism. They fruit of his life. Not the miracles of healing etc.
        He is a user and abuser, a domineer der, manipulator, has a temper that reaches to heaven, sexually abused his children, he is full of pride, full of him and himself, he lies and deceives etc. He is not open for any corrections. He is bulldozing his way to the top through God’s children and is leaving a trail of broken people behind and does not feel a damn about them.
        But all of this is hidden under this dress of Christianity.
        A true wolf in sheep’s clothing.

  25. Cory,
    ………….”You ask for Proof?”……………
    Frankly Cory, one week in scoan is not far enough to see the wolf under the sheepskin. He is far to smooth a 419 nigerian. You need to become an inside disciple, for a lot of years, before you will see his true colors. In about 14 years with him, I had seen many people first hand shattered, because tbj promised a lot and produced nothing. O, yes and they were all on emman tv. Just like you have seen, but back at the ranch, only disillusioned and broken people were left. Tried as they could, tbj ignored them flat out. They never could make contact with him again. And O he had his ungodly reasons. So, ya, tbj and you can do just what you want, you will NEVER convince me ever again that there is any genuiness in him. I have seen too much proof that he is not what he portrays to be.
    He is a true evildoer.
    A man of god, with the character of the devil.

  26. And Jesse,
    I think you are right. Cory has too much vested interest in TBJ Watch to not be an insider. It will anyway do him good to be on this blog.

    • Insider? You accuse me yourself of not knowing enough about SCOAN…”Frankly Cory, one week in scoan is not far enough to see the wolf under the sheepskin”…remember that? Now you and Jesse are telling me that I’m an insider?…comical! Your wishy-washiness is evident and I would label you both as stable as Paul Agomoh on where you stand in your accusations. Now we’re at the point in this debate where your foundations are beginning to crumble and you’re beginning to contradict your own statements…as I have shown above.
      Secondly, Jesse…you state, “I know of tons of people who went and came home empty handed. So much for “Emmanuel, God is with us”. If God would be there as in Jesus’ Time, all would be healed as Scripture proves”. Wow, bitterness, bitterness and more bitterness. And you label me naive?…where do you get off telling God he HAS to heal everybody? I don’t play God, I leave that to him. I didn’t deserve to have my knees healed, nor do I deserve anything else I have…but you seem to think that all of these people ‘deserve’ healing from God?….like God OWES it to them? I have a feeling your bitterness is personal as well. God doesn’t owe YOU, or me anything, including healing. Rom 9, he’ll have mercy on who he has mercy, he’ll bless who he blesses and curse who he curses. I’ve seen very poor people with diseases that would say they’re blessed, and I’ve seen very wealthy people who still don’t have enough and are ‘bitterly ‘pursuing happiness. The difference is the attitude in their hearts. As I said a few days ago above, I deserve nothing and am grateful for everything I have…down to the very air I breathe. I don’t live a life of entitlement as you seem to hint at in your statement quoted above. And Joni ET? I’ve been able to hear her story in person. She’d be the first person to tell you she made a bonehead decision to dive in shallow water and she’s lived with that her whole life, but one thing I see different between you and her…she still proclaims that she’s been blessed in many ways and has pursued an even closer relationship with God amidst the devils temptations to live a bitter/accusatory/entitled life. YOU can say she’s ‘cursed’…but she’d say the opposite is true. Truth: THERE IS NO SICKNESS JESUS CAN’T HEAL! Headline to you Bible-believing Christians who attack that statement….that statement is 100% true. But who am I to tell God where/when/how to heal?….again, I’m not God, nor is he at my command, nor will I question Him when he chooses not to heal. His divine will is a mystery. I’m at his mercy…and any grace he so decides to send my way (in my case-through the healing through TB Joshua), I’ll take it and be grateful and not question Him on why you’re not healed.
      I didn’t say anywhere you weren’t blessed…again, another assumption. I said “I” am BLESSED. YOU can decide for yourself if you’re blessed or not based on the condition of your own heart, I won’t (and can’t) do that. I was blessed before my trip to SCOAN in many ways…God gave me more grace while there…and I took it.
      Just Wonder at 7:44pm, wow…man…those are some really, really, really hefty accusations. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and believe that you really care for me personally and don’t want to see me hurt/deceived and say thank you for caring…that is until I saw you accused me of being a liar…”Did Cory now change into the old Soe? You know how they can lie.” and Jesse’s…”Did you not know they are all colourful deceiving lying chameleons down there in SCOAN”…is this what you’re calling me? I think you’re beginning to cross the ‘friendly line’, I’ve drawn. I took up this debate in hopes to honor Christ in the process. I won’t stoop to your level. If it requires that, I’ll kindly bow out. A liar deceives others by suppressing the truth. An honest person simply states what they saw or know to be true personally (without external influence). And no, I don’t know SOE, but I appreciate the encouragement from them.

      • @ Cory,
        1. You are clearly more than just a casual visitor of SCOAN, seeing you dig up stories that I don’t even know.
        2. Your persistent and false misrepresentation of me in all aspects that is key and standing out to SCOAN members when they come online and discuss matters with those that are representing TB Joshua Watch and other posters.
        3. When it comes to bitterness, it is because of people like you who are only thinking about themselves how to gain and stand in the lime light and then display their false humility of how undeserving they are. That is that deceiving chameleon description that applies to them that I gave you.
        4. Statement and understatement, nobody is transparent in SCOAN, everyone is secretive, always on a mission they don’t tell anyone, even if it would be picking their nose, selfish righteousness, thinking that they are “speshul” because they are working against those that are a personal threat to their position, selfish egoism of how many tables and chairs they can carry up the stairs, involved in the “high level” ministry and make no room for others who aspire the same, going abroad on other people’s monies while others have to dig in their own pockets to get there, creating a deliberate closed circle only for those who are fanatic about the ministry, constant lying, betraying one that makes a tiny mistake and harass them until they can’t even be around their false selfish personal importance, thinking that everyone is from the Devil, except them, while they themselves are full of skeletons in their closets, I can go on and on.
        The according about honouring Christ. Really ? If your story is honouring Christ then I am Batman, because your false humility is key in your conversation of how humble you are and now you have “received” what came for you confront everyone of stupid we are and do your utmost best in all registers open on your pipe-organ and drum kit to make everyone look as bad as possible and black mail them, not even to talk how you satanically and willingly creating a low self esteem and negative image in others with your high horse conversations as if we are not worthy for anything good, yes ? You have been known for that since you were young and growing up and despised in your own family for that and many times confronted too and yet you keep using this harp for your own importance as a weapon against others. You like to cut and shine through that you are always right from where you come from and nobody else know nothing and are just stupid.
        If there was any bitterness as you claim to imagine, then it was because people like you who wield their uncontrolled self importance power to rule over others with your own low self esteem you try to compensate in oppressing others to receive something, because after all it is all about you, your healing and blessing and TB Joshua and the whole of SCOAN and your “personal” Jesus nobody has than you and those in SCOAN.
        PS why don’t you send in your personal information about your doctor, doctor’s papers and proof of your knees being destroyed of your claimed arthritis and operations as well the proof of the doctors that you are healed, to the email address of TB Joshua watch and they can send it to me for verification. But I guess I will not have to hold my breath for that.
        And concerning honest persons ? There are none, because all fall short of the Glory of God.

      • Cory, you are correct. Jesus can heal anything.
        I think (hope) that you will not last long with SCOAN, because you simultaneously acknowledge that it is not man’s demands or faith that produce healing, but God’s will and actions.
        See, in SCOAN, and with many other faith healers, that is unacceptable. Faith *produces* heaing, and failure to be healed is a direct result of poor faith. Not God’s will, not God’s choice, but the fault of the unhealed, or some variation on the same theme (demonic whatever whatever).
        The question is not whether Jesus *can* heal, but whether faith-filled demands produce healing, willy-nilly. As far as I know, all of us who have commented in opposition of TBJ’s heresies believe wholeheartedly that God is fully capable of healing anything.
        What we doubt is a: the claim that God *must* heal according to our demands if made in enough faith and b: TBJs claims that what is presented at scoan is actual healing, much less God’s healing work as opposed to some other possibilities.
        The bitterness you see in Jesse is not bitterness towards God, or his choice to heal or not. It is bitterness directed at people who tore down Jesse’s faith, by first insisting that true faith manifests healing, and later denigrating Jesse’s faith as not good enough, since healing wasn’t manifested.

      • @ M.,
        ” It is bitterness directed at people who tore down Jesse’s faith, by first insisting that true faith manifests healing, and later denigrating Jesse’s faith as not good enough, since healing wasn’t manifested.”
        I don’t feel bitter, I am just appalled how some of these TB Joshua followers can believe in things that are not true but fabricated, like this new thing with that calabash that I found on revel2123 YouTube site and he even put his name of his account above Emmanuel TV and shamelessly promotes this.
        I find it starts to show their intelligence at room temperature when you start promoting idiotic foolishness as real and what the Devil does in that form. If a so called witch Doctor can “conjure” up a calabash in somebodies stomach, why would God want let a boy cough up the thing out of his mouth ? As if God could not just make it disappear. But then again I don’t believe zip of that stamped on calabash video clip what they have fabricated to make frenzy in church. So much for, 1 Corinthians 14:40
        Let all things be done decently and in order. This video is clearly directed to make frenzy in side the church and nothing else and people just watch this and swallow without using their brain cells that it is complete garbage and craziness. I am glad I left, because otherwise you end up in lunatic asylum and start to think like fools. I will not be surprised if they will pass this off as in the following scripture 1 Corinthians 1:27
        But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; etc etc.

  27. @Cory,
    reading through your comments under this thread reminds me of myself on this site several years back, and I know it reminds tbjoshuawatch of me too if they’re honest enough to admit it. I spoke not a few on nearly each article then, and after I stopped because tbjoshuawatch and supporters would not listen, I never thought I would return to this site for any reason whatsoever, but your presence on it and the quality of your responses make it worthwhile for me. Perhaps they would listen to you and be turned from their error and the wrath they have already incurred.

    • Just another thought – Jesus’ disciples NEVER followed him because of the ‘Powe….r” they will receive if they kiss his toes, but rather asked Jesus to teach them to pray!

    • @ Soe,
      Oh lookey, see what the cat dragged in ? It’s coming out of the wood works all of a sudden. Soe !!!!, oh, thou great sage of the false doctrines concocted into your dark and mystified prison cell of deception and confusion. Welcome back ! We are all ready for you to teach in detail to you the true Gospel of Jesus Christ of Nazareth and slap you on the wrist for twisting it as you see fit. The gloves are off, Soe, so be ready. Until we are seeing you running off with your tail between your legs again and again.

    • @ Just Wonder,

      Did you not know they are all colourful deceiving lying chameleons down there in SCOAN ? They blend in when they see and smell a lead to make themselves look silly. They come all out of the woodwork and arsenal of blow up into your face when they have a lead that was no lead. I love to chuck in chew toys for wolves in sheep clothing. Watch them inflate to huge proportions as hot air balloons and buffoons. You have been warned, ;-)

    • haha. Bombing, eh? Here’s a bit of news: Lying is lying, always. The type of manipulative language and hyperbole used by SCOAN and TBJ followers also falls under the category of lying. They have enough native English speakers among them that “language barrierr” is no excuse. It is clear that their words are chosen specifically and deliberately to manipulate and inflame the emotions, either to anger towards those who question their prophet, or to more adoration of their prophet. Either way, LIES, y’all.

      I shall count it as a compliment that I was quoted directly, lol. Although, hilariously, there were a dozen other comments of mine that would have suited their hype and emotional manipulation better. Seeing my “Oh snap!” comment just made me giggle. I cannot fathom why they chose that off the cuff comment as an example of the supposedly egregious lies and false claims they say we’re making. If I’d said “TBJ is a false prophet because he has a tail and purple spots on his chest.” now THAT would be something to get riled up about. But I didn’t say that. ‘Cause that would be a lie, and I’ve never actually lied. I can only assume that everything else I wrote was to tangled up in Scripture and sound reasoning for them to make use of it (and since I am no scholar, clearly it doesn’t take much at all for them to be unable to handle the truth).

  28. @ All, especially those from Watch TB Joshua,
    Alert ! Alert ! Alert !
    TB Joshua Prophecy NOT coming to pass ! So much for claiming to be infallible.
    Now once and for all admit about your fake prophet TB Joshua.
    http://news.yahoo.com/suspected-boko-haram-gunmen-attack-nigeria-school-military-115523625.html#
    Above post is from yesterday….
    It was coming to an end according TB Joshua was it not, from last year February or March 2013. Please add link. Watch TB Joshua and TB Joshua followers, this one is for you all. When you can show me a real prophet let me know. Seriously !

  29. In regards to the “Well, so many people can’t be wrong!” claim, here is this:

    http://www.saibaba-x.org.uk/5/The_Cult_of_Sai_Baba.html
    Sai Baba amassed around 6 million followers. Can 6 million people, devoted and absolutely convinced of his god-hood be wrong? Is it possible for a single man to con and decieve 6 million people. Um. YES. 6 million people can be wrong. A couple thousand people can be wrong too. Numbers do not validate a minstry. Feelings do not validate a ministry. The Big Man’s nice demeanor does not validate a ministry. How much money he gives to charity does not validate a ministry. Strange happenings or remarkable events do not validate a ministry.
    When fact and experience come into conflict, if fact does not win out, then what you have is a cult.
    It is fact that TBJ has made inaccurate prophecies. His followers make various excuses for it, but by those excuses admit the inaccuracies. And those inaccuracies invalidate his claim to be a prophet of God.
    It is a fact that he has labeled his annointing water “The Blood of Jesus”. And it is a fact that this is blasphemous.
    It is a fact that his followers and media machine use hyperbolic and manipulative language, along with blatant, incorrigable, and unapolagetic editing. It is a fact that these practices equate to lying.
    It is a fact that all of the above led to a stampede which killed 4 people in Ghana.
    It is a fact that TBJ has taught serious unBiblical and anti-Biblical heresy, on the mic, in front of the cameras. Though interestingly when those have been called out, many of the videos have been quickly pulled from youtube, without explanation, retraction, or apology.
    It is fact that physical and mental abuse happen at SCOAN. This too has been acknowledged by SCOAN defenders attemptint to justify these practices by saying “It’s cultural! It’s normal for us, so it’s OK!”
    It is a fact that many of his followers view him as a guru, messiah, and possibly an incarnated Christ. It is also a fact that he has not publically and consistently rejected and rebuked these ideas, but let them continue and even has broadcast some of them without correction on E-TV.
    No miraculous experience you may have at SCOAN eliminates or justifies these facts. Whatever experience you may have, whatever warm fuzzy feeligns you may have, whatever percieved improvement in your life you may have….none of them rescue TBJ from the face that his heresy and extra-Biblical practices disqualify him from the position of prophet and pastor.

    • Hmmm, my videolink also disappeared. I think there may be a glitch in wordpress? However, google “The Man Called God.” for the video reference.

  30. (in case of another glitch, breaking the link so you can copy and paste: youtube.com/watch?v=pqy58LSanas)
    Anything look familiar? We have miraculous “manifestations”, masses of followers, a wheelchair healing, and a freakin’ Scripture reference at the end. Does any of that validate Sai Baba’s claims that he was god?

    • @ M.,
      “Accusations against Sathya Sai Baba by his critics over the years have included sleight of hand, sexual abuse, money laundering, fraud in the performance of service projects, and murder” ayayayai !
      Sounds very familiar is it not ? Scammers have so much in common up to a tee. Just like in SCOAN. For the gullible and easily deceived it is the “Mecca of Christianity”. For the discerners who have been there and involved for years at the forefront an undeniable scam hole. Just onky one prophecy will show the fall ability of TB Joshua. God never spoke, but when one goes by the rumours of the land and inside information you can see there it all panned so wrong. Admitting it, is just their everlasting twisting it to look as if he did not say it. Sold ? Sold to what or who ?

  31. @All
    I have followed all your debates and I find them very interesting and informative. Further, I would like to commend Cory for bringing lots of ‘wealth’ into the discourse from a pro-TBJ persperctive. What I have observed from a lot of discussions about SCOAN and TBJ is that MOST TBJ followers just react emotionally and irrationally when the doctrine of ‘ the man of God’ is called into question. Psalm 105 vs 15 is almost always their ‘ weapon of mass destruction’!
    Now Cory, since you are debating graciously and maturely, please help me with the following questions:
    1. Why is it that today’s miracle workers never heal visible handicaps eg, a wilted arm or leg being restored to its normal size; a BLIND person seeing etc – not just headaches, painful knees etc.
    2. When 4 people died and dozens were injured in Ghana during the stampede for the ‘anointed water’, why didn’t TBJ raise the dead and heal those that were injured?
    3. How come TBJ did not predict ( and thereby prevent the tragic loss of life) in his own backyard when he can predict plane crashes and deaths of presidents half way around the globe?
    Please show your usual rationale and maturity in your replies.
    Thanks and God bless

    • Excellent post! I must say that I appreciate Cory’s tone thus far. A blessed relief from the usual vileness from scoan followers who post here.

    • Hello Survivor, here’s my responses to your questions:
      1) Why did Jesus spit in dirt to make ‘mud’ out of his saliva, then rub it in a mans blind eyes, then tell him to go wash it out in a pool later when he COULD of just said ‘receive your sight’??? Why go through all the trouble? Why did Jesus go through all the trouble to search 5,000 people only to find 5 loaves of bread and 2 fish, then have them sit down in groups, then multiply the bread, then spend (probably) hours distributing the bread and fish to the 5,000 people to eat when Jesus just could of said in a really loud voice ‘BE FULL’, and they would no longer have hunger? Why did God go through all the trouble and added drama? I’m not sure…but he’s God and that’s what he decided to do, that’s how he decided to heal or perform the miracles. He does them his way…not ours. Isn’t child birth a miracle? I think it is, especially after watching my girls being born. Isn’t it a miracle (a wonder) how God made our bodies to heal themselves naturally? I find it not a ‘coincidence’ that these flesh-eating diseases (that are quite gruesome but he way) in their videos (that were getting worse every day) immediately stop getting worse after receiving prayer and then heal from that day moving forward (some in a few days, some in a few weeks). You ask for ‘visible handicaps’ healed right in front of you…here’s some for you to view. A man crippled for 10 years (who scoots around on his rear), that walks instantly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lj4WtEfNADg&feature=c4-overview-vl&list=PLFXyqE7wNYI7zXqzVxc7lFHrLttlqnjp3 The healing of a young boys leg instantly, including the disease gushing out of his leg immediately after prayer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXM960QtnXQ ‘a Blind person seeing?’…here you go (forward to 2:07) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgk2iBuK9uc&feature=youtube_gdata Those are per your requests, sorry I couldn’t find one of an actual arm being grown back, but I’ve accommodated the other examples you requests above.
      2) Your question goes along with this one…”Why doesn’t TB Joshua go into hospitals and just heal EVERYBODY then? Why do we even have hospitals anywhere near him. My answer is this. He (TB Joshua) isn’t God, nor does he claim to be. Your questions (all 3 of them) suggest that he IS God….that he can do what he wants, when he wants. That he has this tremendous gift of healing at his utter disposal to use (and heal) whomever he (TJ Joshua) wants. That’s simply not the case, he stays in tune with the spirits leading and is at it’s (the Holy Spirits) mercy, not the other way around. I mentioned earlier, that I believe if God told him to go to a hospital and heal everyone there…then he would be faithful to those instructions, and do it…and they’d all be healed. But how can he do this is the Holy Spirit doesn’t instruct him to do so? If he tried to do this without the Holy Spirits leading then it would be of his own (mortal) power and it would not happen.
      3) Matt 27:41-42: “41 In the same way the chief priests, the teachers of the law and the elders mocked him. 42 “He saved others,” they said, “but he can’t save himself! He’s the king of Israel! Let him come down now from the cross, and we will believe in him. 43 He trusts in God. Let God rescue him now if he wants him, for he said, ‘I am the Son of God.’” 44 In the same way the rebels who were crucified with him also heaped insults on him” -so because TB Joshua predicts events across the world (and saving others) and doesn’t predict an event right in his backyard (to save his own) that means he’s a phony then? I can’t use that assumption rationally.

      • Cory, do you have any familiarity with medicine or health knowledge? I ask because I can’t concieve of someone who does presenting any of those three videos as truth.
        Video #1: The first problem is the utter blasphemy in that video, starting with labeling him “the man at the gate beautiful” which implies TBJ has some kind of apostolic position rivaling that of Peter and John. Second is the “healed” man saying “I met TBJ, a picture of Jesus, in my dreams.” So that’s the first WHAT????
        But secondly, I watched the whole video. I’ve seen it before. And it was one of the ones that set off red flags for me. Initially, indeed, the man is scooting on the ground. What is clear, however, is that he does have musculature and some strength in his legs. He is using them to move himself forward and bearing some weight on them, even in his sitting position. When TBJ steps on his legs, indeed, he stands up. With difficulty. He takes a few shaky steps, and the camera cuts out. The next time we see him he is dressed up in a fancy suit. He gives his glowing testimony. Then we see him walking to prove his healing. Only what is this? He walks like a man with weak but moderately functional legs. Hm. He cannot dance. In truth he is shuffling, not walking. He is concentrating very hard in order to maintain balance and stay upright.
        There has apparently been no actual physical change. He can move his legs and bear some weight on them, just as he could before. He is choosing the more difficult mode of walking over scooting, because that is what is expected of him.
        This is supposed to mimic the miracle at the Gate Beautiful? In what.freaking.way? What did the healed man do in that case? Did he go to Peter and John? On his own power? Or was he carried in because his legs actually had no function, not for the purpose of meeting a prophet but for the purpose of begging? When the healing was accomplished, did he shuffle like an old man?
        Video #2: Again, we have an initial problem of LIES. That is not a cancer. That is an ulcerated infection. They are not uncommon. But in SCOAN, everything is “Cancer” because that’s so much more emotionally gripping than a boring old common infection.
        Moreover, it is extremely common for such infections to involve a: pain, due to the swelling and the infection itself, and b: lots and lots and lots of disgusting pus. And an infection that is “ripe”, meaning it has come up close to the surface, takes but the tiniest bit of pressure to burst and exude a river of that disgusting blood and pus that was accumulating there. This is 0% miraculous, 100% normal and common.
        I actually dealt with one of these in one of my own children. His pain was excruciating. He limped. He could not sit because of the placement of the wound. I was going to take him to a doctor to have the infection lanced, but the thing “ripened” over night, and with just a small application of pressure, it opened up and out came a horrific, vomit-worthy flow of blood and pus, in remarkably varied colors. I could not believe how much kept coming out of that apparently “small” infection. And guess what? My child was immediately relieved of all his pain. He walked normally. He could sit without discomfort. Did i perform a miracle? Absolutely, positively *not*.
        In general terms, the resiliancy and self-healing nature of our bodies is miraculous. The design is miraculous. But neither of these cases is actually miraculous, because have simple and frankly obvious physical explanations. Miracles are by definition *uncommon* and *not explicable by natural causes*. Walking on water is miraculous. Draining an ulcer is not. A withered or absent leg becoming whole again is miraculous. A man with weak legs who scoots becoming a man with weak legs who stumbles and shuffles and looks like he’s about to fall down at any moment is not.
        Video #3: Again, i have to ask, are you SERIOUS? Are you for real? This is what you consider proof? Again, have you any familiarity with health and physiology? The blind woman screaming I can see–who knows what her brain is doing while under the suggestion of TBJ, but she is clearly still relying on touch and noise to direct her movements, and I see no evidence that her vision has actually been restored as claimed. Her movements are those of a blind person or someone with severely restricted vision.
        And the rest. “I see low sperm count!” Um. ??? And in between, CS Upthegrove, a man who is a “big name” only in his imagination and that of SCOAN followers, and a disciple of AA Allen (the drunkard), verifying, according to him, that God said “TBJ is MY prophet.”
        I’m sorry, but I cannot ignore the Biblical twisting, the emotional twisting, and the manipulation of facts in order to take any of this as proof.
        “My people perish for lack of knowledge.”
        Oh how tragically accurate that is.

      • Regarding part 1 of your answer, you’re missing the point of our criticism of the anointed water. We’ve never claimed that God can’t/won’t use water as a source of his healing, as you rightly state, many things were used in the bible. No problem accepting that. There are two differences with TBJ’s anointed water. 1) He’s made it a standard part of his ministry. There may be biblical precedent for certain things being spontaneously used for healing, but there is no biblical precedent for mass distribution of anointed mud. Anything like this makes an idol out of the substance. People put their hope in a small bottle of water, not in the healer. 2) So far I would say that the anointed water represents false teaching, but the second factor takes it from false teaching to outright blasphemy. That is the way it is labelled “The blood of Jesus” (previously it said “for the salvation of your soul”). Please, please tell us how you, a mature and learned Christian, can possibly support such outright blasphemy. What right does TB Joshua have to take the name of the most precious thing ever, and plaster it on his bottles of water as a marketing scam? This is outrageous.

      • TbJoshuawatch, in response to your comments on the anointing water:
        I’m glad we both agree that God can use anything to do his work (including the anointing water). Next question…the ‘mass production’ of the water or making is a ‘standard’ as you worded it…taking it to a ‘systematic’ level…yes?, when it’s originally displayed in ‘spontaneous’ examples in scripture, yes? …am I hearing you correctly? I’m hearing you argue the ‘systematic’ approach to harboring God’s power. Meaning, I hear you say your against the ‘scheduled’ performance/healing/revelation of a typically ‘spontaneous’ expression of God’s power like we see in the healing and/or miracles of (for example) spit/saliva, Moses staff, Peter’s shadow, Paul’s apron/handkerchief…all spontaneous, and “un-systematic” (for lack of better terms)…can you tell me if I’m hearing you correctly, so that I can respond correctly?
        and your #2 issue is pretty clear to me…I’ll respond to both when you confirm I’m tracking with your #1 mentioned above.

      • @Cory Yes, you’ve described our objection fairly accurately there. The bible not give a precedent for this mass production of healing materials, so your examples (saliva & mud, handkerchief) do not apply. Furthermore, the act of mass producing and administrating healing materials such as the anointed water creates a false idol. However, these objections pale in comparison to the blasphemous marketing of the water. I look forward to your defense of that.

      • M, I’m not a doctor but I do have a general (well rounded) understanding of health knowledge. The way you nit-pick the very small and minute details but fail to acknowledge others is clear proof to me that you only see what your heart wants to see, you’ll only acknowledge what your heart wants to acknowledge in defense of you agenda. Bottom line, this man hasn’t walked in 10 years (by his own confession-and others around). And you ‘assume’ (again) he’d much rather scoot around on his rear everywhere than walk?…really? You’re telling me this guy ‘could have’ actually walked before, but he just ‘prefers’ to scoot around on his rear all day instead. These accusations you make are much more unreasonable and far-fetched to believe than the miracles themselves. They really are. So because he had ‘some’ movement, ‘some’ strength’ and ‘some’ motor control in his legs, then that means he could’ve walked on them? Hmm, that’s not a true statement? My wife is physical therapist (for over 15 years now) and she currently works in a geriatric setting. Let me tell you, based on her seeing the video….you’re assuming this person could’ve already walked based on the movement you saw in the video while they were scooting on the ground?…that’s not true. She has elderly patience with more control, strength, and ROM (range of motion) that this man in the video and they’re not walking either. Look at his severely atrophied legs, they’re as big around as my wrist (again, something you failed to acknowledge). And, of course, he’s going to be shaky….HE HASNT WALKED IN 10 YEARS!….really, let’s get practical here. Now, you can question ‘why’ he immediately didn’t get up and start doing jumping jacks, or why he didn’t enter the next local marathon, but my faith tells me this…this man hadn’t walked in 10 years (and it showed in the video), and he’s prayed for, and he walks! Regardless of the condition (or more importantly, the LEVEL of leg strength God decided to give him), I don’t doubt…I believe. This man didn’t walk, and now he walks. Those reason, and rationality are much more sufficient than the belief than man preferred to scoot on his bottom all day and rally gained nothing from this healing…the tear and trouble in his eyes are worth a 1,000 words.
        2) Do you understand generic lingo?…particularly cultural? Have you ever called someone a ‘looser’. If I were taking your approach to this arguement I’d respond to you this way…” Now, M…don’t you have any knowledge of sporting contests?…in order to be a ‘looser’ you must have competed in a competition and lost, accruing to a the score. How can you call someone a ‘looser’ when they weren’t even in a sporting event where a score was kept?” Then you’d respond to me and say, “We’ll no, they weren’t in sporting event…when I use the term ‘looser’, it doesn’t mean ‘literally’…it just means they’re ‘jerk’ or ‘low-life’ (or something to that tune)” Wouldn’t you respond that way M? I would if someone took my use of the term ‘looser’ literally….but in our culture today, we know when we hear the word ‘looser’ what that person means (and it’s not a sporting event type of use-typically). BTW, this is just an example to make my point, although this is a rather lame example, it proves my point of how words are not always used literally. And M, I don’t mean physically ‘lame’, ok?…I mean that my example may come up short to you, but it proves my point of taking words literately out of cultural uses. Ok? Moving on, I agree that this boys leg in not the ‘literal’ cancer we see and deal with here with surgery, chemo and radiation treatments. In this case, they use the ‘generic’ term cancer for an infectious disease. Haven’t you ever heard someone with a really negative attitude being labeled as ‘cancerous’? They’re negativity spreads out to others like an infection…it just keeps on growing. They’re ‘cancerous’ because the sickness, infectious disease, is debilitating and spreading to other parts. This is the case here, it’s a generic terms for a very serious illness that has caused the boy a lot of pain (who could barely walk) and as you can see, it spread all through out his leg from the the knee-down. Now that I explained the generic use of the term ‘cancer’…you say this is “0% miraculous”?….well, I guess miracles are in the eye of the beholder then. I find it NOT a coincidence that this boy has struggled with sickness for some time and the second that TB Joshua prays for his the infectious substances immediately begin to gush out at this moment. I simply don’t find that to be a coincidence, not one bit. The timing of TB Joshua’s prayer and the complete discharge of all (and that was a LOT) of junk out of his leg, and within minutes he running all around is simply not a coincidence to me. So because you can MEDICALLY explain, the birth of a child…it’s not a miracle? I saw my two babies come out and let me tell you, just because the entire conception, growth, and birth stages can be explained medically…I SURELY don’t write that off as not being a miracle. As your your boy you say, “with just a small application of pressure, it opened”. It this case no-one touched this boys sore…it just began gushing…no picking, no external pressure. But, I’m sure you believe that ‘just happened’ on it’s own too. I saw it, and I believe it was no accident…neither is this universe, neither is creation (although it can be scientifically argued through evolutionists, just like the same way you ‘medically’ ague against these healings). I see, and I believe. And what you believe is on you.
        3) So you think this woman is just all of the sudden screaming “I can see” and acting exactly like someone who has been blind and received their sight back would act…is just plain nonsense then? She’s really not seeing?…but she’s just screaming “I can see” for no reason then? You have done one thing for me M, you’ve proven that your lack of faith even makes Thomas look naive. Wow, you see…I mentioned this some time above and here it is again…just for you:
        “I have a feeling your skepticism will be your undoing (if it already hasen’t yet) friend. Guessing that you’re one of those people who read something and then say…”no wayyy, I gotta see it”. Then, you’re shown the video of it then you say…”no wayyy, I gotta talk to them myself”. Then, you talk to them yourself and then you say…”no wayy, I wanna see the spot on your body that was healed”. Then they show you the spot (or whatever) was healed on their body and then you say…”no wayyy, I wanna talk to the doctor to verify it”. Then, you talk to the doctor to verify it then you say, “no wayy, show me the X-rays”. You’re shown the X-rays, and then you’re left in desperation and discredit the whole system. You’re held captive by your lack of faith as your ‘demands’ have been met one by one, you reap more and more unbelief on your own heart and are stuck in a rut that only grows more bitter and bitter over time…obsessed with supporting your lack of faith by harboring some form of pride (or something of that category) in you that call other people ‘gullible’ or ‘lemmings’ like folks have done here. One thing Thomas had going for him was at least he finally believed when he saw. I can show you the physical healing right in front of your face (from unedited video)…you can hear the peoples testimonies yourself (just like I gave mine), you can see X-rays/bloodtests/clinical release letters/whatever you want to see, but I can’t make you believe. That’s on you friend.”
        And finally…you quote this? “My people perish for lack of knowledge.” (Hosea?, Proverbs?)
        …but yet you ignore ALL of the new testament scripture regarding FAITH?….wow. There’s a gazillion, I won’t even post one. Enough said.

      • TBJoshuawatch, in regards to your argument against the ‘systematic’ distribution of SCOAN’S anointing water you speak against vs. your acceptance of the ‘spontaneous’ miracles/healings through various mediums in the bible we talked about already. Here’s the dilemma I see in your argument….what are thousands of pastors across america to do then? They have ‘scheduled’ their church service every Sunday at 10am-11:15am (for example). Even more-so, most of them (especially the Type A personalities) have scheduled out FOR THE YEAR what each sermon will be…meaning the topic to discuss, the titles, and the applications. Boom, all done for the entire year. How can this be?, they’ve effectively taken God and put him in a box (a system) and left no room for the ‘spontanaety’ of the Holy Spirit. Mind you, they’ve not taken a box and built it around God…instead they’ve taken God and put Him in their own box of what they’re doing to say/do/preach/sing for the next year. What I mean is that we’ve ‘fit’ God into our SYSTEMATIC approach to worship haven’t we? Don’t we ‘schedule’ (meaning, block out times, rent a building, practice for worship, acquire staff/volunteers assigned to various roles to fill voids, parking attendants, childcare workers, and all the other things that go with pulling of a ‘church service’ in america) Church service for only a set time/day every week…regularly? Stick with me. Meaning WE (the majority of biblically based churches today) ‘systematically’ worship God. With that, healing services…and whatever other ‘services’ (meaning anything that is systematically scheduled) that we would ask God to show up and honor. I think every pastor in the world who’s part of a systematic style of worship (any regular church service falls in this category) asks God to reveal himself to his parishoniers while in attendance of the ‘service’. But, as you and I both agree with…you can’t put God in a box, right? God is much bigger than what happens between 10am and 11:15am every Sunday. He cares much more about what we do the rest of the week than he does what we do with that short time we’re partaking in systematic worship, preaching. BUT…doesn’t God still honor the systematic approach we’ve taken with church? Doesn’t He still show up, reveal himself, convict, draw people to himself, open people hearts, heal and deliver folks in our ‘box’ we’ve made for him? Don’t we still see God moving mightily in a regular, scheduled church service? Even in a sermon that was decided 12 months ago?….yes, we still so God moving in our ‘system’, meaning pre-set schedules, pre-written sermons, …etc. So, while I agree that scripturally, God used many mediums to heal people on the fly. I don’t see anywhere why God “won’t” or “can’t” use the medium of SCOANS anointed water. Regardless if it’s mass-produced, or distributed or whatever…he can use it. And I sure can’t assume that if a Godly person filled with the spirit prays over an item, then it is packaged and sent to me, and then I administer that item in a time of need (whether healing, blessing, or deliverance, or whatever), where that item “couldn’t” be used by God to do whatever it is I was asking of it….as long as it’s in Jesus’ name. Which brings me to your second argument of the blasphemy of what they call it.
        What the box actually says on the front is this (I have it right in front of me): Annointing Water: The Blood of Jesus sets you free from Sin, Sickness and hardship as you minister it IN JESUS NAME. Simply put, there is no BLASPHEMY in that statement. You properly described the Blood of Jesus the “most precious thing ever” in your statement. I agree with you 100%. It’s power, it has the power to wipe away sins, heal, deliver, set free, and whatever else we could dream of…only Jesus Blood can do that. Nowhere do they claim this actual water IS the blood of Jesus, no where. Don’t take my words for it, I’ll read to you what the Anointing Water booklet that came with the water says….I’m quoting from page 4 in the introduction about the anointing water (and no, this is not in small print, this is in large print in the very beginning of the booklet-case in point…no intended deception here, they’re clearly stating this in big print).
        “…before ministering this anointing water, there must be faith both in the person praying and in the person being prayer for. it is THIS that brings about the healing, deliverance, breakthrough, and blessing, NOT THE WATER ITSELF. It IS NOT THE WATER THAT HEALS, delivers, blesses and saves but God almighty Himself, since the anointing is done in Jesus’ name.”
        So, I really can’t see any direct blasphemy here based on your accusations. Again, nowhere do they claim their water is actually Jesus’ blood, as you’ve heard above (printed in their booklet), they say just the opposite…ITS JUST WATER…it’s GOD that does the work in Jesus’ name.
        Question, don’t you take communion as a Christian? I just did yesterday as a matter of fact and it was a wonderful experience for me. But, Isn’t it JUST bread?…Isn’t is JUST juice/wine? I mean, didn’t I simply consume a little bite of bread and drink a little shot of juice!…yes, that’s all I did. But spiritually, doesn’t it symbolize Jesus’ body and his blood?…of course. So, it’s fair to say that spiritually, the elements of communion are much more than JUST bread and juice….they’re the ‘broken body of Christ’ and the ‘blood of christ shed on the cross’. I not going to get out of sorts if the bread/wafer company stamped on their boxes they ship the elements in…’the body of christ broken for you’. I’m not going to send them letters. I’m not saying the companies do or don’t do that, I don’t really care either way. I get it though, it’s JUST BREAD. It’s JUST JUICE. It’s God who spiritually turns these elements into much more that that as we worship, pray to, and call on Jesus. But, I don’t see you guys hammering the people who manufacture this bread and juice do I?. Maybe you’re laughing at that analogy but really, I’m simply using the same argument on things we ‘use’ in the church SYSTEMATICALLY than are ok in certain instances and not in others?….hmmm. Wasn’t Jesus’ saliva and dirt, just that?….spit and dirt?, of course they were. So, nor would I discredit someone if they saved the mud after the man washed his eyes and gave it to someone else and they were healed…could’ve it happened?…of course! But, as we learn from the bible, it tells us that if every miracle Jesus did was written down there would not be enough book in the world to hold them (John 21:25) It was GOD who used regular old spit and dirt to bring someones sight back. So, based on my arguments above, I can’t discredit systematical approaches to ministry, healing, deliverance, distribution of ‘holy’ elements, water, handkerchiefs, of whatever else there was. God can do what he wants, when he wants, and how he wants…INCLUDING choosing to honor Man’s systems, methods, boxes that we so put Him in, and distribution methods, or to not honor them…then God’s choice.
        Here’s my own story. It was Monday at SCOAN, I was sick to my stomach. (I think the water there was finally getting to me or food, but not sure) That day, I had an upset stomach, diarrhea, and all that yuck that comes with it. I thought to myself, I’m going to use this stuff (the anointing water) since I just got it. So, I opened the book, read the booklet, earnestly prayed one of the suggested healing prayers aloud in the booklet and then drank some of the water. My stomach instantly began to tingle and it felt better. All I can is, no more upset stomach, diarrhea. Gone, better. Trivial to you guys, I’m sure, but not to me. I believe. God works in the trivial as well as the major.
        My roommate at the time, Mr. Ely, was there. His family had returned to scoan to give their testimony from their encounter with the anointing water during a previous visit…here’s the story to see for yourself. Mind you, All glory goes to Jesus on this, NOT the anointing water.

      • Thanks for your reply Cory, I had a feeling with your last post that you were leading up to a “gotcha!” moment. Nice try, but it doesn’t stick. There is ample biblical support for the church regularly meeting together as a body, plus there is the witness of church history. The anointed water has support of neither, and as I said several times (and you haven’t responded to) it creates an idol, this cannot be more tragically demonstrated than through 4 deaths in Ghana. Anyway, I don’t want to labour this point, because it’s the smaller of the two issues.

        The biggest issue is the labelling of the water. I don’t know what packaging you’re looking at, but the image below shows two designs of the packaging, if there’s a new one, feel free to post it.
        anointed water
        The one on the left claims that the anointed water is “for the salvation of your soul” and the one on the right simply says “The blood of Jesus”. If you subscribe to the basic tenets of Christianity, I can’t see any way you can justify the first one. As for the second one, the image combined with the text clearly communicates that the anointed water IS the blood of Jesus. The text you quote only makes this worse “The Blood of Jesus sets you free from Sin, Sickness and hardship as you minister it IN JESUS NAME” as you minister what?! The blood of Jesus or the anointed water? If the former, why are they saying this on the packaging? This only confirms the fact that they are marketing this as being the blood of Jesus. Utter blasphemy.

      • @ Cory,
        Just one thing, when you say you can use anything as what is written in the Bible. So then why don’t they make spit and mud for all those who have eyesight problems and write on it the spit and mud of Jesus Christ for the salvation of your soul ?
        Cory loves a good story. You can believe that anything can change your situation as long as you believe in it boil down theology. Prophet Mboro in South Africa has as just every prophet nowadays a bottle of petroleum jelly or salt or T shirt and they even bring their underwear and knickers to church to be blessed, ofcourse you would be standing in front on the front row to promote such exciting stories that only can come from Cory. Only cult organisations make such things to keep the populace happy with folly things and can’t teach the people normal preaching and how to develop faith all by themselves as it says faith comets by hearing and hearing the word of God. Which is now replaced with booklets, bottles, faith wristbands, salt bags, petroleum bottles and whatever they can concoct to entertain people with.
        It is and still will be a scam church as simple as that. It is and always will be.
        Ps I have seen people with thinner legs walking than the men you so desperately try to justify, that TB Joshua has healed him and where is he now ? Nowhere to be seen.
        http://www.nairaland.com/107618/looking-classical-decent-sugar-mummy ( picture of woman with extreme spiney legs)
        And in a even worse case of atrophy:
        http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/woman/real_life/4702938/anorexic-gets-fan-mail-from-girls-wanting-to-look-like-her.html
        Here is my evidence regarding what your wife so violently denies is not possible and including you. And yet these women walk unaided. And both do not need TB Joshua to stand upon her legs to walk better.
        But enjoy your church of the scam techniques, I hope when you advise another blind girl to watch Emmanuel TV, that God should make you blind for a while so you can try it out all by yourself how that comes over when you say this and you can’t see.

      • tbjoshuawatch, the labeling on the left isn’t accurate (perhaps that was an older bottle), but the picture on the right is currently on the back of the box. The front of the box is labeled just as I described earlier. And as I described already (by reading what scoan wrote), they’re clear about it…they (scoan) doesn’t believe, or teach others, that the water IS the blood of Jesus. They’re clear about it, “it’s just water”…in their own words. No blasphemy. At best, you have an argument for them to clarify the labeling (but doesn’t everybody with any product?, go ahead an nit-pick it)…in the same way someone complained about McDonald not being ‘clear enough’ about their coffee cups being hot, so guess what, now they added a warning label on the cups for the folks with a lack of common sense. Again, scoan makes this point clearly…it’s Jesus who heals…not the water itself. But hey, this gives you guys something to start a website about, and all feed each others desire for controversy and drama…wondering what would you all do if TB Joshua didn’t exist? Who would be your next target with all this spare time on your hands? My wife is beginning to wonder why even I’m spending so much time on here…I’m trying to justify my time on here but I sense it may be coming to an end at my wife’s request.
        You state “it (the water) creates an idol”?. I simply can’t blame any object on this planet today the was intended for good, that someone develops an obsession for, or abuses. Nor can I blame TB Joshua for M’s husband’s obsession with him and she described above. Nor can I blame the medicine when someone decided to overdose/abuse/idolize it. Is it the 4 deaths in Ghana that you all keep mentioning that really bother you?…How many people die in automobile accidents every year?….why aren’t we picketing the car manufactures then? I hear you…”But Cory, those are cars and ‘accidents’….people aren’t idolizing the cars (we’ll many do, especially here in america but that’s beside the point).” Ok then….Case in point, BLACK FRIDAY: people are injured, hurt, and even killed in a stampede to get THAT toy for THAT price…idolizing toys?…yep. Who’s fault is it?….the toys?…well, of course not. Ok then, the ones who made the toys?….of course not. How about the adults who sleep, dream about, and probably idolize THAT toy?….that’s a big 10-4 on that one. You see, I can’t blame no one but the person themselves for the obsession.
        You say, “The text you quote only makes this worse “The Blood of Jesus sets you free from Sin, Sickness and hardship as you minister it IN JESUS NAME” as you minister what?” EPH 6:12 gives us the clarity where our battle really lies, not in what we see but in the unseen, spiritual realm. With that, the power of praying/calling on the precious blood of Jesus over our lives, over our conflicts, over hurting relationships, over our sicknesses, or anything else that is causing us trouble in our lives can penetrate directly to any spiritual/demonic force that ‘may’ be behind that situation, sickness, or whatever is troubling us in our lives. This water is symbolic of that. I don’t NEED the water to do that, nor does Jesus. However, if I so choose to spray anointing water on my upset stomach (or down my throat in my case) and pray for healing by “The mighty blood of Jesus”, then so be it. Can’t God use it?….of course, and, He did!
        You state, “There is ample biblical support for the church regularly meeting together as a body, plus there is the witness of church history, The anointed water has support of neither”. You fail to acknowledge the even bigger point that there is more-than-ample support for in the scriptures…that faith can move mountains. Nit-picking, dissecting aside. I believe, and have faith that Jesus power is limitless…there’s nothing he can’t do. Nothing that is happing through the distribution of this anointing water is going ‘against’ the Bible….nothing. You may say to me, “Cory, where does it say in the Bible that it’s okay to mass-produce anointing water and distribute it?”….but, where does it say (or even suggest) not to? Scripture as a whole makes it clear that the Jesus’ power is limitless and his name is above all other names. If people like me want to call on his name or ask his blood to cover something in my life…through the application/ministering (spraying of) the anointing water, can that not be used by God? I see not evidence anywhere in scriptures where it can’t be used by God, in faith. Just to clarify, nor to God HAVE to use it to heal me….just in case you were thinking that. In many cases, God doesn’t alleviate our problems, conflicts, controversies because he’s growing/strengthening us into better people…for the next task he may have lined up for us (James 1:2-4). So please know that theologically, I’m not saying God doesn’t allow us to go through various unpleasant things in our lives to develop character in Him…I surely believe he does.

      • @ Cory,
        You said “You’re held captive by your lack of faith as your ‘demands’ have been met one by one, you reap more and more unbelief on your own heart and are stuck in a rut that only grows more bitter and bitter over time…obsessed with supporting your lack of faith by harboring some form of pride (or something of that category) in you that call other people ‘gullible’ or ‘lemmings’ like folks have done here”
        Typical replies for pro SCOAN people not even reading the Bible while they claim they do and so called apply.
        Matthew 17:20-21
        And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief:for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a GRAIN of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you. 21 Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.
        How big does one’s faith have to be ? We are all given a measure of faith, is it enough to move mountains. A full heartedly, Yes ! But when a SCOAN follower, or disciple, leader says you have of faith, they are just discouraging you with what you had by telling you, you have to get a bigger faith, or have to be on the level of those self imposed super apostles, which they so eagerly want to cosy up to, to get the advantage being in the limelight too and as errand boy for the ministry, which you know will be granted to you and your family when you give everything away for that ministry, if not your own soul too at the expense of other members in the family or of that of others and are incapable to reconcile with them, because those other members of the other family do not see eye to eye with each other. Then to me it comes over as being hypocrite and use that scripture of the bible to pretend you don’t have any family or wife, is it not ? While TB Joshua reconciles families on Emmanuel TV, he is incapable to reconcile others, by the so called power of God that is “vested” in him. How hilarious and at the same time sad this is.
        There are a lot of claims of this and that, but the interpretation of cosy SCOAN followers are always expressed to uphold the ministry in operation, while there are a humongous amount of holes in each of their lives is concerning many things and personal issues, but turn a blind eye to them, willingly and deliberately.

      • @ Cory,

        You said “and pray for healing by “The mighty blood of Jesus””

        Now you have made the Blood of Jesus to as or equals healing ????

        I have tried to find Scriptures for that…. Can somebody help me with that ?

        I found this:

        Matthew 26:28
        For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

        Hebrews 9:22
        And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

        So Sicknesses = Sin ? Or Sin = Sickness ? So if that is what you think, it means than you got sick because you sinned inside SCOAN where you were then ? What sin did you commit Cory that you got diarrhoea, begs the question.

        hamartia: a sin, failure
        Original Word: ἁμαρτία, ας, ἡ
        Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
        Transliteration: hamartia
        Phonetic Spelling: (ham-ar-tee’-ah)
        Short Definition: a sin
        Definition: prop: missing the mark; hence: (a) guilt, sin, (b) a fault, failure (in an ethical sense), sinful deed.

        266 hamartía (a feminine noun derived from 1 /A “not” and 3313 /méros, “a part, share of”) – properly, no-share (“no part of”); loss (forfeiture) because not hitting the target; sin (missing the mark).

        266 /hamartía (“sin, forfeiture because missing the mark”) is the brand of sin that emphasizes its self-originated (self-empowered) nature – i.e. it is not originated or empowered by God (i.e. not of faith, His inworked persuasion, cf. Romans 14:23).

        So you got healed, because you had sinned..,and by applying the “anointing water” you got healed ?

        So did you first ask forgiveness for your sins then, before you applied it or you just applied it because you thought Oh well, I might as well use it, without asking forgiveness first. Hmmm.

  32. and Cory and Soe;
    So what do you say about the Boko Haram ‘prophecy’ of tbj that has not come out?

  33. @ All,
    We can see how easily one is deceived as in the masses. Just look at Katy Perry, daughter of Keith and Mary Hudson.
    Watch her latest clip “Dark horse ” and then watch here saying this http://youtu.be/10rx15v28yk
    Where she admit between nose and mouth ” the sold her soul to the Devil”
    Now how many followers has Katy Perry ? Well, let Twitter give you the answer.
    The 29-year-old singer happily told her 50 million Twitter followers that she helped bring a newborn into the world on Wednesday hours after news broke she split with boyfriend John Mayer.
    Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/katy-perry-helps-deliver-baby-living-room-article-1.1703746#ixzz2ucdEGDIi
    So umm what baby was that ? Would you want as a Christian deliver your baby by Katy Perry ? Even her own father said she is from the Devil.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/04/katy-perry-dad_n_3214718.html
    So much for having millions of followers who like Katy Perry.
    I have written several times to her dad to warn him and his wife to not allow her to get married with Russell Brand, yet still they let it go through and look what came from it all, Disaster.
    Sooner or later this will be the same on the TB Joshua story. Does it not say that the Devil is deceiving the WHOLE world in Revelation and THAT there will be a small remnant that does not let themselves deceive with his con tricks. My warning to everybody MAKE SURE …..you are in that remnant and dish the desillusionment of the trickery in the charismatic witchcraft camp that will drag millions into hell and the destruction of their own salvation by being misled of mortal individuals passed OFF as the messiahs of this day !
    Revelation 19:20
    And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
    Make sure you are NOT in that remnant which Jesus will slay with the Sword and destroys.

  34. Hi @Tb Joshua Watch, I’m a Nigerian who have been a regular visitor in your site, but I choose not to comment because I just preferred taking a neutral stand on your writing and debate. I don’t know if you can help me to get the email contact of Mr. Cory. Since he has been commenting on your site, his comments seems to be very interesting and debating, I want to have a private chat with him. I continue to pray for God to open the eyes of our kind to see what may have prompt you people into this tasking mission. Thank’s for your understanding.
    Remain bless
    Miss. Marry Jame
    marryjame0@gmail.com

    • @ Marry Jame,
      Fine blame me, I have chased him away. Gee, why can’t I ever ask for personal evidence of his doctor and the healing he claims to have had in SCOAN. Soooo embarrassing. Too close for comfort ?

      • Jesse, this will be my final response to you.
        Based on your rant here: http://tbjoshuawatch.wordpress.com/2014/02/18/repost-touch-not-the-lords-anointed/#comment-13481 , I would hope that you feel better…but I have a strong hunch that it only fueled your very prevalent seed of despair from within. Your name-calling has effectively taken me back to my grade school days when I have willingly decided to take the ‘high road’ when my peers have not. When my buddies all decide to go out and get drunk or ‘get high’ that night and I decided to stay back, I’m labeled ‘self-righteous’, or “speshul”, or called names like ‘goody-two-shoes’ or the typical…”Oh, so you think you’re better than me, huh?” Thanks for reminding me that I’ll face persecution for doing the right thing. As I mentioned earlier, regardless of what policies I disagree with, I won’t slander the president, and I won’t slander you. Simply put, I’m just a fallen human being that is ‘pursuing righteousness’ (1 Tim 6:11) and I will continue to do so.
        But know this Jesse, TB Joshua aside, I really hope you don’t take this hatred, anger, and bitterness to your grave. I really, really don’t. This is Cory, signing off.

  35. About the abuse to the women and girls. TB is playing a game. He forces the women in a role, as if they are very special for him. The iniatitive comes only from him. He plays a deep dirty game with their innocence and naivity. He plays as if they are the ones who trouble him with their lust for him. So he constantly appeals to their; evil-demons in lusts, marriage, seducing, prostetution,, adultery and fornication. He feeds it, very subtle and very slow. The natural love they have for him becomes mis-formed by his speculations, accusements, blamings,suggestions. He insinuate with no stop, that they come to ruiing his marriage, his ministery and his purity. He punisch them for not commited sins, and delivers them from not existing demons. It is a dirty seks-loaded game coverd by ‘mystical spiritual utterances”. He fabricates one story after the other, and at the end the girl-woman is the prepator. She be comes sick of his advanches, sick suggestions and stories, becomes hurted and harmed in a stragedic cheap play, and at the end, when she has endured all his claims, scornings and refuses to go on with it, he dumps her without any mercy, after she did tremendous works for him, without any reward, any respects and any defense. Only the girls who are in agreement with him, stay under his controle. They choose for it, to be use like he designs.

      • Something the world needs to know:
        Proof that Jesus is God.
        John 1:1-31 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
        1. John 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.
        2. John 20:28 28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
        3. Romans 9:5 Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of the Messiah, who is God overall, the Messiah, forever praised! Amen.
        4. Titus 9:13 while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ.
        5. Hebrew 1:8 But about the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, will last forever and ever; a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.
        6. 2 Peter 1:1 Simon Peter, a bond-servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours, by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ.
        7. 1 John 5:20 And we are in him who is true–even in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.
        John 10:30 “I and the Father are one.”

  36. Jesse, yes, i gues more authoric men like the woman-girl without any will, to from her as he likes it and call it ‘submission”. There is a lot of confussion in th Bible of the role of the Woman. Most christian men believe she was created to serve him. The fact is, she came to help him, as a equal. paul was a confused man. In Spirit, men and women are equal in The Authority in Christ. The man as the head of the Home and the glory of God and the woman as his glory has a deep spiritual meaning in the divine order. Spiritual maturing awakening in the real meanings of the Word, is a slow proces. The more religious, the more chrisitan men will hang-on to the old form of enslaving women. In this time there will be revolutions for women, because God called them out in multipliing honours and favours.

    • @ Jamie,
      I have no problems with women who have a career or are in authority. Unfortunately there are women who are like a Jezebel and ruining men because their spirit and soul can be overtaken by the demonic and intends to destroy men and even women. There are very pleasant women who have authority, who are spiritual and I like to be in their company and talk to them about all kinds of things what they like to discuss. I do not talk to women on my own and in closed rooms. In general I prefer in an open space or just in a group or at home together with others.
      Unfortunately quite a few women as well men have gone through abuse, perhaps rape, domestic and or by sexual abuse. Maybe also by verbal abuse or some men as well women find they are not handsome or pretty enough or not feeling that inside of them and are looking for compensation of their low self esteem. Some women and men are able to get the best out of it. Some women and men have just built a skewed wall of their lives and usually meet other men and women that are in a similar position. They might get attracted to each other or make friendships because the sort of kindred spirits. Men and women can help each other when they understand these weaknesses and pray together or pray alone to resolve this together with God and true friends. Fixing things like that are not instantaneous as you see in SCOAN but can take many years to repair.
      I was amused and interested that Cory finally reacted on my post that I sent before. Door is shut from Cory’s side now. That’s ok. I had a look inside of Cory, interesting but a common situation. Again I noticed the pattern of using their own experience with a phenomenon that is the rationale in SCOAN, should be universal with all others, according to Cory. The fact of Feeling of “doing the right thing” is not a point for me. By all means do so. Cory made it to a problem regarding what I said, but everyone has their own opinion nowadays and goes with it and is only inflated with their self importance and false humility because they find that they believe they “have” to belong to something or somewhere to live by or be somebody. My personal experience is that most people need others to lean upon because they found or know they have very bad self esteem. Predators will see and know this and will take advantage of that, by using them and extract all that they want out if them and when no longer functional they discard them, drive them suicidal or even murder them themselves.
      The reprogram process is in many organisations and passed off as preparing them for something. This is businesses, schools and churches. A programme. In all those places it could function, but usually in all places it turns ugly. Maintaining authority and the use of the greed of power usually slowly corrupts the inside out of everyone. When in business, you will be disciplined and or fired, when in school, you get detention, when in church you get disciplined and humiliated.
      Authority is a strange thing, but necessary, but it is how and when it is done and if it is character building, establishing confidence and stability in those that receive this by wisdom applied of the enforcer and the application of constructive power instead of being destructive, demeaning and humiliating.
      Most authority is abusive because they can and use it for enforcing their own (low) self esteem which turns into abuse if you don’t listen to them or obey them or when they cannot keep a grip upon the situation in precedence. My experience with many Christians and leadership is they want take control of every situation and circumstance because they believe that they must do so instead of being vulnerable and relaxed. Literally all of them blame the Devil or some demons/devils/spirits they fantasise and concoct up, instead that they look inside where they have gone wrong themselves and work on that to correct that. Or get more educated how to deal with difficult and moderate discisions.
      Single women tend to be or pretending to be vulnerable or severely overly ruling, defensive and aggressive when approached by authoritative and cocky men. Single men sometimes behave with low self esteem, pretending to be strong and aggressive when approached by other authoritative men and especially authoritative women. Everything is ok with all sexes when you do what they want you to do and above all listen/obey to them.
      I absolutely do not believe or acknowledge the demon interrogation in SCOAN especially on women. My experience with demons in people is completely the opposite. I acknowledge demons to manifest, but not behave as they claim in SCOAN they do. If you study demons and spirits and the Bible you will see this is not existing and Jesus did not many deliverances at all, nor mass deliverances either. Why in church they do it ? SCOAN is sensationalism and that is it. Vomiting is for dogs, not for public display of people writhing on the floor, especially women. It glorifies the deliverance and method, demeans the women as well men but does not make any glorification to God about it, except the participant panting Thank you Jesus, Thank you Jesus. A lot of theather, no content whatsoever.
      This is done to a lot of women and the picture is in SCOAN that almost every divorcee, single woman and even married women have some sort of demons and or spiritual husbands or wives. This is used as a tool to use women as they are in SCOAN and in other churches. Just to let them look as second rank citizens. So wrong in all aspects.
      I acknowledge that not only women are used like that, so are some of the men. Same sort of story.

      • Jesse, you touched on many important things. I was going to comment on the issue with women, but forgot about it. The degradation of people is a habit at SCOAN, but I notice that it is very commonly degradation of women. Perhaps some will blame the “weakness” of women for the majority of those who flail around on the floor, urinate, vomit,claim to seduce, etc. IF that is the reason, then WHY is SCOAN not just allowing it to happen, but creating a set up in which it is pretty much guaranteed to happen, and those women and their thrusting pelvises and vomiting and degrading “interviews” are then broadcast publically to the whole world.

        Someone please explain to me how that meets Biblical standards of promoting decency, honor, discretion, and order within the Body of Christ.

        It doesn’t. It appeals to the flesh. There is something completely disordered about people who sit for hour after hour after hour, watching this kind of vile degredation with a stupid grin on their faces.

        Furthermore, while there may be exceptions, the vast majority of “marriage healed” testimonies focus on the wife’s failures as a result of her being demonized. The common theme is “My wife is so mean! I don’t know what’s going on! I don’t know why she hates me! Why am I in such a sad state!” And then the wife gets “delivered” (in the usual demeaning public fashion) and has to stand there during testimony time listening to her pride-bloated husband list all her faults to the world, telling all what a spiritual failure she was, and how she beat him and had sex with demons, blah, blah, blah. And how now everything is perfect and oh look, there’s a baby to prove it.

        Which is a load of piffle. It is ridiculous how many men behave like baboons to their wives for years, mean, discontent, abusive, harassing, complaining, selfish, thoughtless…and then the day she decides she’s had enough and starts speaking up, these men don’t have the strength to consider whether they may have some part in the difficulty. They whine and moan about how “mean” their wife is, and drag her off to SCOAN for deliverance.

        Men, if your wife “suddenly” starts acting discontent, instead of assuming she’s demonized and dragging her to SCOAN to humiliate and degrade her publically, maybe take a few months to fast and pray and consider whether she’s unhappy because you’ve been an ASS all this time and she’s just had enough of it. Introspection and changing your own behavior will go a lot farther towards healing a marriage, with longer lasting results, than a nonsense “deliverance”.

  37. @Cory, for some reason the comment thread won’t let me reply to your rebuttal directly.
    Though honestly, there really is not much I can say, other than man, you have drunk ALL the koolaid. :/ What is interesting to me is that your response to my points is way more disjointed than your other posts, which tells me that I did strike a nerve and you are really grasping at straws to avoid the reality presented to you.
    If what TBJ is doing is a “miracle” in the sense that birth is a “miracle”, then by that definition I am a “miracle worker” 4 times over. Yay me. Where do I sign up for my Apostle Prophet Healer medal? TBJ claims *special* powers, not generic “God made our bodies miraculous” miracles. If his miracles are as generic and normal as the “miracle of birth” then for what reason did you travel to Nigeria to get close to them? If he did not claim special powers, then the deadly stampede in Ghana would not have happened and he would not be accountable for 4 deaths. If all of these miracles are nothing different than the “miracle” of birth, then there is nothing special about his ministry whatsoever. This is a tactic of distraction that you are trying to use, but it doesn’t actually work. We’ve already btdt with scads of other SCOAN followers before. TBJ claims special powers. He is thus subject to specific and intense scrutiny and is obligated to be accountable to the church body (which he is not).
    We can go back and forth about the details. But there is not much point. But I will say this–yep, someone with no other resources absolutely could choose to scoot over walking, with legs as weak as that man. As unteady as he was on his legs, scooting was far more efficient and safe. I will ask again how you justify comparing this “healing” to that at the Gate Beautiful. You excuse his inability to actually walk as “well, of course not, he hadn’t walked in 10 years.” Does that qualify as a dramatic, instantaneous, FULL healing? No. It does not. That makes the whole presentation from SCOAN a lie, to start with.
    I ask again, what was the response when God healed the man at the Gate through Peter and John? Did that crippled man who had no use of his legs AT ALL stumble and shuffle? Did he? Are you willing to answer that? No? I will answer so you don’t have to. The man at the Gate Beautiful, who was the beneficiary of a TRUE healing miracle, got up and went WALKING AND LEAPING. Immediately.
    There is no comparison, and thus SCOANs comparison is yet another lie.
    Your excuses about calling things cancer is just beyond the pale. I don’t even know what to say to that, it’s so outrageous and such a desperate grasping to try to maintain the facade.
    You initially presented yourself as a thoughtful, peaceful person and maintained that through much of the conversation. But now you are starting to show the colors of SCOAN. WHO ARE YOU to judge my faith because I do not believe that TBJ is something special? Really? Who exactly do you think you are? You do not know what I believe about anything, except that I think your precious prophet is nothing more than a trickster. You have no clue what my theology is, nor my position on miracles and the work of God. You do not know what trials God has brought me through, nor what blessings I have experienced because of my relationship with him.
    If you read thoughtfully, you would have noted that I, on the other hand, have not denied your faith or your love of God. I am quite firm on the fact that just because someone falls for spiritual deception, doesn’t mean they are unintelligent, unfaithful, or necessarily Biblically illiterate. Successful cults don’t rely primarily on decieving the easily decieved. They rely on hooking people and drawing them in by their human vulnerabilities. I have no problem believing that you love God and have a strong faith. And ftr, I did not call you a lemming. I responded to a specific logical fallacy of yours, by pointing out that “it must be true because so many people think it’s true” is called lemming behavior and asked if you are OK with falling into that behavior.
    But you have successfully confirmed to me that the theology and doctrine of SCOAN is inherently twisted and eventually captures all who take a bite of it. When questioned, even those who are initially apparently open to reasoning together, if confronted with enough specifics, will eventually devolve into simply attacking the faith of the person who refuses to bow to TBJ and his false doctrine and blasphemous practices.

    • M, you said, “What is interesting to me is that your response to my points is way more disjointed than your other posts, which tells me that I did strike a nerve and you are really grasping at straws to avoid the reality presented to you”. Ha-c’mon now, it can’t be that I have a wife who’s giving me dirty looks while there’s a hot meal sitting on the table could it?….or I’ve got 2 girls that need my attentions and I’m on here speaking with you all….again, easy on the assumptions. I’m enjoying these conversations and having fun debating you all directly, honestly, and rationally.
      You say, “If what TBJ is doing is a “miracle” in the sense that birth is a “miracle”, then by that definition I am a “miracle worker” 4 times over.” Who gave you the ability to give birth? not you, right? Even to say I ‘made’ my 2 girls…think about it this way: If I claim to have ‘made’ my two girls, then it’s like me claiming to have developed the reproductive system also…which I had nothing to do with. In a sense I guess you’re sorta a miracle worker, don’t you feel blessed by God to have given birth to 4 little ones?…and been an active part in that ‘miraculous’ process?
      You say here, “Does that qualify as a dramatic, instantaneous, FULL healing? No. It does not.” Okay then, so YOU tell GOD how AND TO WHAT EXTENT he should heal people? How is it up to decide to what extent he should’ve been given back leg strength? Again, as I mentioned above…just because he doesn’t stand up and start doing jumping jacks, or sign-up for the next local marathon then he’s not healed? Your criticism of the miraculous healing still shows me of you have your own standards of what a miracle is. Bottom line, this man hasn’t walked in 10 years…now he does…INSTANTLY in front of our faces. Please don’t pick apart ‘how’ he walks. Heck, if he did walk better that that…then you’d say, “But look Cory, he’s still pigeon-toed, it wasn’t a FULL healing”, or “Well then Cory, how come he’s not running up and down the aisles then”. Can you hear yourself now?….I can! M-if God wanted this man to start leaping, then he would’ve made him to do it. It’s obvious, that God wanted this man to walk (regardless of what YOUR definition of walking is). The miracles are similar in that, both men couldn’t walk and they walked instantly…that is the main point of the comparison. The other details that you ‘hinge’ your entire argument on again reveal a hidden agenda and true closure to even wanting to believe. “Oh, but Cory…this man didn’t ‘lead around’ like the guy in the bible”…M, really? This man hasn’t walked in 10 years, and he stands and walks instantly…that, my friend is worth celebrating in joy and praising God about. NOT being sad and saying, ‘well, yea…he’s walking, but he’s not leaping’. I have a feeling this man’s heart was full of joy for the fact that he can walk, and I have an even stronger feeling that he’s not the least bit sad he’s not ‘leaping around’ or able to run a marathon….just a hunch, but hey…I’ve been drinking too much kook-aid so what do I know.

      • Keep on with the excuses Cory.
        No, I’m not telling God how he can perform miracles. I’m telling you that SCOANs claim that their “gate beautiful” supposed healing reflects the actual biblical healing by that name. It doesn’t. A ministry that starts with a lie. Hm. What does that tell me about their character?
        TBJ is the one claiming extraordinary powers, with his followers claiming he is The Prophet. One who claims extraordinary powers who has to lie, excuse and manipulate in order to maintain his image as “extraordinary” is merely a liar. In this case tbjs lies led to the deaths of 4 peopke directly and who can say how many died as a result of stopping necessary medications because they were proclaimed “healed” by him.
        IF that was a true healing, by your own admission it was not an extraordinary miracle but a miracle on the level of childbirth.
        either Tbj is something special or he’s not. Make up your mind. If he is, then his miracles should match the claims made about them. If not, then your defense of him, not to mention your international travel are waaaaay out of proportion and totally unreasonable.

  38. tbjw
    jamie just said that APOSTLE PAUL was a confused man and all you could reply to all that followed was a big AMEN?! You all seem to be getting TOO familiar. What really is this blog fighting for. The right to be seen as correct in all your assertions and denouncings as per SCOAN or just a get together of chums for some jaw jaw using Christianity as a pretext to associate? None of my biz just thought to wake you up and I don’t have your e mail. Whatever makes you happy anyways. Safe.

  39. @ Cory,
    I appreciate your reply to my post but I have a few more questions.
    I did not get to view the videos you linked to but I appreciate @M for her reply.
    1. You say TBJ is not God for him to heal as and when he pleases, but further you say (the clergy) put God in a box by tailoring church programs eg, weekly, monthly etc, but God still works in those man-tailored programs, right? So in effect, why can’t TBJ walk in any hospital (after tailoring that program) and heal the sick there? Better still, why can’t he start travelling to various places world-wide, esp, to the poorest countries where desperate people go to desperate lengths just to raise money for an air ticket to SCOAN? Jesus did travel to various places to preach the Gospel and to heal the sick. I know their was no satelite TV back then, but since ‘distance is not a barrier’ Jesus could have said something like ‘ all you sick people in Samaria, for example, you are healed! Are you not contradicting yourself on this score?

    2. Someone has to take responsibility for the tragic and untimely deaths of those 4 people in Ghana. Those people BELIEVED that the anointed water could solve their problems, that is why there was that stampede! So now who do we blame here? Is it the SCOAN branch in Ghana? Or is it the person who made them believe that anointed water was a panacea for their problems (TBJ)? Oh, maybe since TBJ is not God as you rightly say, then God is to blame?

    • 1) I’d say this ultimately, TBJ can’t do anything unless the Holy Spirit leads him to. If he tries, then it’s of himself, and not of God…thus, powerless. I was reading in scoan’s book ‘roadmap’ about his much money, rice, support (wheelchairs) they give away to the physically handicapped people. Why weren’t they all just healed then?, right? And you’re right, Jesus did travel to various places to heal the sick…what’s your point? Are you saying TBJ doesn’t?…look up his crusades in Indonesia and Singapore…watch all the people that were healed there. You may not get this survivor, but if he’s a true Godly man (which I’m arguing for, and you’re arguing against) then he’s in tune with the Spirit’s leading. Meaning, IF the Holy Spirit was leading him to walk into a hospital and heal everybody there…then I believe he would do that. I rest in the fact that God is God, and his plan for the world, and peoples lives (whether handicapped or not) in HIS plan, not mine. Distance isn’t a barrier, we see that in scripture…Jesus heals people by just speaking it (matt 8). He mentioned their own faith as being the catalyst as well in this instance…take note of this.

      2) you say, “Someone has to take responsibility for the tragic and untimely deaths of those 4 people in Ghana”….yes, the people themselves, not scoan. The person that ‘made them believe’?….you say? Ok then, so if you just finished watching Superman the movie, then you believe you can fly and go outside and jump off a building and die…will your parents sue the filmmakers? I would think not, absurd. See my response above (here) talks about what I think about that…with modern day examples. http://tbjoshuawatch.wordpress.com/2014/02/18/repost-touch-not-the-lords-anointed/#comment-13574

      • Ok then, so if you just finished watching Superman the movie, then you believe you can fly and go outside and jump off a building and die…will your parents sue the filmmakers?

        I’m sorry, but that response just boils my blood and shows you to be completely lacking in compassion. The only similarity is that both Superman and the anointed water have make-believe super powers, the difference is SCOAN cons people into thinking the powers are real. Four people believed in these powers and lost their lives for it. Four people (someones son/daughter/mother/father/brother/sister) would still be alive today if it wasn’t for TB Joshua’s anointed water. And that’s before we get started on the many who have died having swopped their medication for anointed water (even the BBC have reported on that) or those who have been infected with HIV from someone who was falsely led to believe they were healed. God will one day hold you accountable for your support of this despicable deception.

      • Blame the victim. Shame on you. Your comparison is ridiculous but to take it where you want to go, that makes the anointing water a fiction and a fable, a fairy tale.
        if the water is a fairy tale like superman, then TBJ is a liar.
        So again, shame on you for blaming people who were taken in by SCOANs presentation of that water as practically a magic talisman. The scoan facebook page was covered in tedtimonies of it working that way, yes, even scaring off armed robbers. SCOAN intentionally presented that water as extremely powerful and the Christian equivalent of a powerful talisman. To people for whom culturally that has a very strong draw. SCOAN is responsible for those deaths, and by virtue of being the founder and leader of SCOAN, TBJ bears the ultimate responsibility.
        do you also justify the physical and emotional abuse that is known to hapoen there?
        SHAME ON YOU.

      • @ Cory,

        You said “IF the Holy Spirit was leading him to walk into a hospital and heal everybody there…then I believe he would do that”

        So by all means we should not go to hospitals then until God is going to instruct usvto go and heal them. What a crock. With other words we should just terminal cases die because God did not instruct us to go and heal them.

        How about so many of SCOAN who went with a bottle of “anointing water” and sprayed it over there in hospitals, houses, places. This same answer you give, would apply then to all bottles of “anointing water”. You cannot use it until God instructs you to use it. And you all use it because TB Joshua says you should use it. Talking about contradicting yourself, this is it. When will it stop ?

        Mawhahahahahaha!

        PS. I was given numerous bottles of “anointing water” for my problems as well my wife and have been sprayed countless times with it and I even have drunk it, sprayed in my face and body with it, I put some in 2 litre bottles and drunk it and yet……still nothing happened. Nothing. Nothing healed, no miraculous things, no financial breakthrough, no special this, no special that, nothing. At that time I believed in it, but when you go on for a couple of years and still nothing has happened, I thought it was good and proper to call it a day on the scam church. Before we entered in SCOAN we were constantly blessed and had breakthroughs about all kinds of things and that without using gimmicks and point of contact.

        I was wondering what happened over the years why nothing happened after that ? Any clues ? I know what happened clearly we got duped and given pacifiers to suck upon, while we were there, while the leaders who were full of demons while I was there kept on scamming everyone else. I mean every week there was a different audience. What is clear to too, simply Rotation of other church members from different churches where they held their meetings. Guess what, most of them were African. So much for an established church they claim to be.

  40. I’m sure it does ‘boil your blood’ TBJwatch, I’m sure everything I said does…but you can choose to hang on that statement if you’d like but make no mistake about…I’ve shown my compassion all over this blog with my postings. So while you can label me ‘lacking compassion’ and ‘pluck’ that statement out and plaster it in every reply you have…the overall evidence of my words during this debate have been gracious (and compassionate) to say the least…as some of you have generously commented on. YOU brought up the deaths, not me….I spoke to those deaths rationally with reason relating the black friday analogy with your ‘idolism’ claims of the water and to ‘whom to ultimately blame ‘ (since you’re all looking for someone to blame) for that idolism and it’s repercussions. It was a quite reasonable example of idolism. While my heart does, of course, go out to anyone who been effected by the loss of a loved one. The facts remains the same, people have tragically lost lives due to peoples unholy elevation of the creation, and not the Creator. I don’t worship or idolize and created thing….only the creator of those things.

    • If there is somebody who have been interacting here with compassion and kindness it must be Cory.
      The fact that he has good points ,you people cant handle this.Hence you keep looking there and there anything to stick with your false assemptions.

      I still wonder if you would blame God for all Israelites who died in the desert when God had promised to give them a land that flows with milk and honey.
      Would you then say :
      “NO promised land No death in desert ” as you used to say No distribution of anointing water No stampede!
      All these deaths have one thing commun: To not follow instructions!
      And whose fault is? God? Moses ?TBJ ? Ghana authority ?or the people who did not follow instructions of God nor of men of God, nor of Ghana authority.

      @Cory,you have said it all with so much wisdom, really may God bless you in Jesus name!

      • @ Kik,

        You said “If there is somebody who have been interacting here with compassion and kindness it must be Cory.”

        Unlike you who have been miserable, mean, backstabbing, evil, deploying and supporting charismatic witchcraft prayers, twisting, nasty, piece of work, willingly allowing to go to hell, etc. etc.

        You should be last to comment here with endorsement of Cory, you now want to hide behind to justify your masters actions.

        When I addressed Cory as I did, I saw through his false humility and using his “own healing” what has not been verified by anyone of us, which he uses as defence with no wayyyy, no wayyy statements in a former post which he replied. I want to remind you of Cory who loves a good story in where he claims about the man that could not walk for 10 years and he was pretending that he was not a believer that somebody could walk with such legs because he was going by his wife’s diagnosis of atrophied limps. Yet when I prove to him that there are people who walk unaided with atrophied limbs he as well you hide behind each other cowering because you cannot explain that it is so.

        What is clear, you are on a programme and agenda of your own and you will keep justifying the errors and lies of your masters that you represent. Good for you. Keep thinking God does not know about you both, who are sinners just like everybody else and think that TB Joshua and Wisemen are without sin and never make mistakes.

        Ps. I saw TB Joshua apologising about the powers that he displays is not him, yet when you look at it, it clearly looks how he every time he walks up to a person as if he “throws” something to them what merely looks like some person is coming out of his body inhabits the people that stand there and start to remote control them and throw them over. And you still try to tell me that the Holy Spirit works that way right ?

        Nothing in the 66 books of the bible talks about such manifestations. So conclusion, that is not the Holy Spirit, but a powerful demon that is written in II Thessalonians and in Revelations that heals and shuffles other demons around in those people. Same observation I did with the Wisemen.

  41. Cory,
    Your comparison of TBJ’s anointed water and automobiles or superman movies is making a mockery of innocent, poor and desperate people. Automobile manufacturers or Hollywood directors do not claim to represent God Almighty. TBJ does. That’s a monumental difference. The fact that you are trivializing the deaths of 4 people (who sincerely believed TBJ’s doctrine about the anointed water) has shocked me. Would you write off the deaths if some of the dead (even if they were only 4) were your loved ones?
    I live in (Southern) Africa and believe me, the levels of illiteracy here are not as low as over there in the United States. And for those who are literate, it’s either they are too lazy to read books (the Bible inclusive) or they are preoccupied with other things. So owing to these high levels of illiteracy and ignorance, people here will believe anyone who performs some kind of miracle. Even David Blaine or Criss Angel can command a massive following if they can sugar-coat their tricks with the name of Jesus!
    It reminds me of a South African pastor who recently made his congregants eat grass! Yes, grass! Just because they were brainwashed into believing that they should never dare question the ‘man of God’! They even proudly quote Psalm 105 vs 15.
    I’m a liberal person but what surprised me most about TBJ is the antagonism and aggression that characterizes the vast majority of his followers. Over here, if you dare question TBJ’s doctrine or the famous anointed water, or the car sticker, people will look at you as though you’re the devil incarnate. And that is for the few tolerant ones. Others will insult you; call fire and brimstone from heaven to consume you and your family. I have never seen any other ‘man of God’ who inspires so much animosity in his followers as does TBJ. So please don’t put the blame on these people. They are sincere and desperate people who want to hold on to something, someone.
    Cory, you’re among the extremely few TBJ followers who show maturity and Bible knowledge. Please don’t spoil that by trivializing important things such as those unfortunate and avoidable deaths in Ghana. I shudder to imagine how many people would die if TBJ came to Southern Africa. People idolize TBJ over here.
    Finally, I think those vague prophecies about plane crashes, or deaths in general are callous and only serve to promote the man TBJ. Can you imagine if you lost a loved one in a plane crash and before you even dispose of the body, you keep watching videos on Emmanuel TV boldly claiming that TBJ predicted the particular disaster? Wouldn’t you ask why he couldn’t avert the disaster by warning the particular people concerned? But since the prophecies are mostly ambiguous, would you rather the whole region over which the prediction is made shut down, eg no more flights in case of a plane crash ‘prophecy’?

  42. Cory
    that was just LOW from you denigrating the dead. Take it on the chin as a man and retract your obnoxious posts. It is possible that those who got trampled upon where early birds who had come to the venue on time only to get smothered by latecomers who pressed from the back. Could have happened to anybody’s family members. SCOAN is responsible for the fiasco.

      • and to see that someone is backing him up on his faux pas takes the biscuit. Jesus wept. USE YOUR BRAINS HOMO SAPIENS!

      • TBJW,you are the one avoiding anything critical when you avoid to publish my comment!You like criticizing others but don’t like to be criticized.This site contains too much hypocrisy!

      • Ahh, yes, yes…let the people hang on what they want to hang on. What I am describing is FUNDAMENTALLY the issue you all are failing to address. Put your fickle, human, ‘feelings’ and ‘emotions’ aside for a moment and address this issue rationally from it’s foundation, please. Here’s the example again…tell me who you think is at fault:

        BLACK FRIDAY: people are injured, hurt, and killed (3 in 2013) in a stampede to get THAT ‘item’ for Christmas at a highly discounted price. Who’s fault is it?…the toy manufacturer?, The Toy Itself?, The Store?, Jesus? (because it’s for a Christmas present)…or the people who are obsessing over the toy?….Who do you think is at fault?…please answer that.

      • I hold the people responsible for the Black Friday chaos, there’s a big difference though. They are greedily going after the hope of getting a real product. In Ghana they were going after a false promise of “salvation” and healing, and they got completely the opposite. Yes you can hold the church responsible for that.

        Since you’re going on at us for not addressing issues, how about you address the “for the salvation of your soul” issue?

      • PS-you ‘pluck’ what you want out of my statements and accuse me of making a mockery out of deaths, JUST LIKE you could ‘pluck’ Luke 9:59-60 out of the Bible and accuse Jesus with lack of compassion and making a mockery of that man’s fathers death. But, of course, as we read ALL of Jesus statements, we can come to a general conclusion that obviously Jesus was very compassionate. As is the case with me and this forum, just read EVERYTHING I have written before you make a claim on my heart’s intentions.

  43. daemondada if at least you can use your brain just once in this “ghana stampede” issue you would know that all over the world where huge invents occurred gathering massive crowd,stampede had happened or did not.

    I would like to know whom you will blame for these ones too

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PhilSports_Stadium_stampede

    http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/01/02/16295451-death-toll-rises-to-16-in-stampede-at-church-event-in-angola?lite

    The recent ones

    http://edition.cnn.com/2014/01/05/world/asia/china-stampede-deaths/

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/19/world/asia/india-deadly-stampede.html?_r=0

    Do we see “anointing water”there?and whom to blame then this time!!!

      • You’re doing a good job of demonstrating why you got banned in the first place, large volumes of comments that don’t contribute anything. If the signal to noise ratio doesn’t improve the same will happen again.

      • Lol, TBJW,I seems you are not happy,did I touch your raw nerve?
        You cant have nothing better to say on the issue when the truth is right in your eyes.
        Dont blame me when it didn’t go the way you wished.
        Let me go before you call your best follower Jesse to curse me.

      • @ Kik

        You said and insinuated ” Let me go before you call your best follower Jesse to curse me.”

        What imaginary curses have I said now again ? Please figure out for once with that sheep that has a tail which are seen as a fifth leg by your imaginary beliefs as well the stories from the writers of Watch TB Joshua.

      • @Jesse ,fine ,you have won. I know you people like the word *winning*. May be it means for you to have the last words, whatever junk you may say do not matter as long as you get “the last words” but I m tired of this nosense fight.
        I m only here to read something edifying from Daemondada, Cory even TBJW who are not guided by bitterness everytime they talk ,you may continue your way how it pleases you as well, but now let’s move forward.

      • @ Kik,
        It’s not about winning. It’s about Jesus Christ. Things about that I have all the time referred to. It’s not about me at all, except when I tell what I went through. I am sorry that you never got and still up till now get this. Do you really think that if it was playing jokes and pranks, why would I give up my night rest, my time, my efforts, my energy 24/7 for something like this if I could not stand behind my posts that I put here. You never will accept the facts that there is a big possibility of what I said is true, as God is my witness.
        All what you want is for me to go away, so that you can torture other weaker opponents, because you train of thought is, when they stop posting here at TBJW, finally TB Joshua can stretch out to do even more scamming with his followers. At least TBJW is here to keep you all on your toes, because we will report any falsehood here and elsewhere so to keep it at bay. This is an honourable thing to do when it comes to justice and righteousness. No matter if you keep thinking that there is no such “job” as supervising crooks spreading their wings of destruction to make even more victims. There is. This is in society as well in the church or even school. Somebody must stand up and say no more. History is full of dictators that took over many places and made millions of victims. The simple reason was because there were none to stand up against them. And no we are not fighting God, we fight together with God, because He is our Leader and not the allegations of we are agents of the Devil. We rebuke the Devil and all his demons, In Jesus Name !, as it was said in Jude, by the Arch Angel Michael. Exactly like that.

    • The point went zooming right over your head, kik.
      The point is, if you create an idol, and then create a deadly situation by drawing too many desperate people into a place where you cannot handle them, yes, you are liable.
      You are trying to excuse TBJ by pointing out that stampedes have happened elsewhere. So what? Not only is it shameful for churches to whip followers into such frenzies over tap water in the first place, but it is shameful for churches who do this to then turn around and blame the very people they have taken advantage of, whose tithes they gladly recieve, whose payments for miracle objects they gladly take, whose names they gladly use to promote their teachings. ANY church that does this is a blot on the name of Christ and should be held accountable. This blog is about TBJ, and therefore the fact that stampedes happen elsewhere isn’t exactly relevant.
      What’s more, given the miraculous powers claimed by TBJ, the Wisemen, and the water, and the fact that the constant theme is that he is the prophet above all prophets, the man of God above all others, the miracle worker, dream visitor, blah, blah, blah, his response should have been *exceptional*. Not the normal pathetic blame-shifting. It seems that as long as he can manipulate things into going his way, he’s happy with the attention, and happy for all the praise. But if something doesn’t happen the way he says it will, or if something goes horribly wrong, all of a sudden it’s: “Don’t look at me! It’s not my fault!” Bullshit.

      • M,what point? I don’t see any point in your comments than avoiding all similars cases that expose your lies.
        I m already aware that this site is meant to black mail only TBJ,you do not have to remind me on that!

  44. Cory,
    If I get you right are you saying that Jesus, The Creator of the heavens and the earth and all that dwells therein demonstrated ” fickle human feelings and emotions” by crying when he saw his loved ones mourning and in deep anguish? I’m beginning to realize why tbjw and it’s supporters see you pro SCOANites as ” insensitive “. If when Jesus exclaimed to the crowd to come to him and drink of the “living water” after which one would thirst no more their occurred a stampede of same proportions to that in Ghana, would Jesus have said “it’s their fault” to the casualties? I have clearly demonstrated that one could be a casualty of a stampede due to no fault of their own. It is clear you are determined not to own up to your gaffe. Why am I not surprised?

    • And with regards to your Book of Luke quotation it is evident that Jesus was talking about the unsaved. The casualties of the stampede in Ghana on the other hand came earnestly seeking “salvation”. Completely opposite scenarios. Don’t get it twisted mate. Note that not everyone is a tall giant as you described yourself. Some considerably weaker persons would find it tough in a stampede. I’m done.

      • Absolutely. The lack of compassion is stunning on the one hand. But frankly no different than expected.

        All you have to do is go to SCOAN’s facebook page to see them promoting the annointing water, in real time, as something pretty much magical. SCOAN, and by virtue of being the leader, TBJ, are directly responsible for making their dirty tap water into an idol, taking advantage of illiteracy, desperation, and simple lack of knowledge. SCOAN created the tragedy in Ghana. SCOAN is responsible. And since TBJ is the founder, head, and primary driver of SCOAN, not to mention pretty much the sole focus of devotion, HE is responsible.

      • D, What? my book of Luke quotation here? Luke 9:59-60? This?…59And He said to another, “Follow Me.” But he said, “Lord, permit me first to go and bury my father.” 60But He said to him, “Allow the dead to bury their own dead; but as for you, go and proclaim everywhere the kingdom of God.”

        That text was used as an example of how ‘plucking’ a few sentences out of it’s entirety can be misleading about a person ‘true’ character, as what was being done do me. Here, Jesus was answering a man who wanted to follow him but wanted to go and bury his father first (understandable, right?), but Jesus doesn’t respond so compassionately to him, does he? Well, of course, that wasn’t the most compassionate thing he could’ve said…and could’ve been assessed as being a person with a strong ‘lack of compassion’, and you all accused me of based on a few words (out of the thousand I’ve typed on here). Now, when we read ALL of Jesus’ words we can easily come to the conclusion that this man was indeed compassionate.

        D, that was simply my argument about the accusations coming my way based on a few sentences I wrote. But moving on…I’m not on this blog to defend myself.

      • @ Cory,

        You said and claimed to have humility” out of the thousand I’ve typed on here”

        What does that mean that you wrote so many thousands of words ? Does it mean that by the amount of words you wrote that you are now qualified to be heard better ? This is always typical of people in SCOAN, they think the more they write, the more they have to be looked up to.

        I get lots of complaints that I write a lot and talk to much, but unfortunately I am a person that can’t express himself to well verbally so I write more than I say and for some I might even be not understandable at all because they only want to see their own side of their story or conversation and conviction. They never leave room for others and are competing to have the highest tweet and song of the birds and digging into their intelligence to outwit others in the hope they can corner them with clever wits, but do not look at the persons present that there is a problem that is addressed by such. SCOAN wants to fight that off by putting millions of YouTube videos, websites, recommendation stories online and elsewhere to promote the cause of SELF and not Jesus Christ. They use Jesus Christ as a vehicle to create for themselves a job and finances to move forward their self imposed programmes of hundreds and thousands of deliverances with no biblical content that a whole heap of nonsense of lying from people and imaginary demons and the silly stories they bring forward.

        When it becomes a factory and conveyor belt of a certain type of phenomenon, the real content of the bible is watered down for the sake of promoting gimmicks and silly slogans what benefits no one to learn about God Himself and His Character, His Son, His Holy Spirit. Everything in SCOAN is now directed on appetising the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh and the pride of life of building a big ministry with no personal exercise through scriptures to develop their own faith.

      • They use Jesus Christ as a vehicle to create for themselves a job and finances to move forward their self imposed programmes of hundreds and thousands of deliverances with no biblical content that a whole heap of nonsense of lying from people and imaginary demons and the silly stories they bring forward.

        Spot on!

      • @ Cory,
        You said ” D, I am not even sure what you’re saying above…..I am not even tracking.”
        Precisely that, because that train of confusion you left the station to begin with has already derailed from its train tracks. If you only paid attention and would have gone through all the posts on this blog from wayyyy back, you could have figured out that there is something wrong at the core of SCOAN, but you don’t want to spend that time on that, because you are full of your own “healing” you claim to have “received”, except nobody of us has seen the evidence or truth you claim. And there is nothing wrong when someone asks to verify this closer up for the sake of something “genuine” as you say happened to you. Until now you only have defended yourself vehemently, but have only brought forward nothing more than your word for it in order for us to believe you. Because I would love to put your claim on the desk of a doctor, lawyer or a police desk in order to verify your claims are real, but until so far nothing has been produced from you (since you are so eager to post videos of TB Joshua, Wisemen), there is no video of yourself or pictures, paper work of doctors for us to see if this indeed is so and scrutinise it to the hilt. But I know, when the heat is turned on on that, I usually can not hold my breath for this to materialize, because I will only be turned down as the so called “faithless pastor” or “hedonistic unbeliever” by the fanatic followers of TB Joshua and wisemen. Uhuh !
        Ps I am aware of your post where you go into a story from Cory of “No wayyyy, no wayyy, ” only to read in your answer that it was directed to call off the bloodhounds that are after you to prove if you are indeed “healed” over there. I can say this with confidence, because I know from some who claimed to be “healed” and “delivered” are still having the problems they had before, but only telling themselves every is Ok, not to “tarnish” their faith in God as they have been hypnotised with from the leaders of SCOAN. As if you can lose your healing when Jesus truly has healed you, they will tell you blah, blah, blah, such and such, so and so, only to sear their own consciousness with a hot iron then instead of admitting they were telling you a nice Pro SCOAN story as Cory has been doing here.

  45. kik,
    Read up my posts to Cory for my response to your inquiry. SCOAN is responsible for the tragedy in Ghana. Period.

    • Daemondada,that is your view, anyway we can never agreed regarding the stampede but thanks for your response.
      Please if you are willing, let me ask you one question if it is ok to you.
      I really wish to know your view regarding TBJ personally.
      Do you believe TBJ is a true servant of God,I mean a true prophet anointed really by God or you believe he is truly a false prophet which the bible says in Mark 13:22.
      If you forget about which fault he might have committed in your own views or what TBJW might have against
      him,do you believe he was really raised by God to do God’s works?
      If you say yes to “he is a true prophet”.What do you think then went wrong with him and what he might do to correct it.
      If you say yes to “he is a false prophet”.Why do you think so or what makes you to believe so about him.
      I m asking this to you because you are the only honest person I have seen so far in TBJW site who does not take sides on its articles when it is not necessary for you of course,and you seem to be intelligent .
      Your response may help many also I believe then.

  46. Thank You TBJoshuawatch for admitting that you’d blame the people obsessed and not the ‘thing’ they’re obsessed with, or the ones who’ve made it. And, of course, I’d naturally expect you to say to me after that…”But, Cory, they’re totally different”. That’s the only thing left to say once it’s admitted you’d blame the person and not item. With that…my comparison is far far far more similar, than different. And here are the main points of both situations: 1) Both situations show an object (thing, item, element, whatever you want to call it) being obsessed over, idolized, and coveted. 2) Both situations show desperate people whose desire for that object trumps all regards for any rational thinking to a point of complete disregard for others safety to obtain it. 3) Both situations display a group of people who are in search of happiness (whether through anointing water, or a big screen tv, or that toy for their kid), attempting to fill some type of void. 4) Both situations have led to injury and death.
    So, by your own admission, you wouldn’t blame the ‘item’ being obsessed over…you’d blame the people doing the obsessing/idolizing. But your claim that my black friday example is ‘not the same thing’ just doesn’t hold any water. Now, we can ‘nit-pick’ the SMALL differences (as M has ‘nit-picked’ the comparison with the healing of man at the beautiful gate because he, in her words, didn’t ‘leap up’ after he was healed, but only got up and walked), but the fundamental truths in both examples are the same. And for that reasoning, TB Joshua or SCOAN is NOT responsible for someone else’s un-holy elevation of an ‘item’ (insert any noun here).

    • @Cory Small differences, yes – they’re small differences. Just like the small difference the between Kool-aid and the lethal cocktail the Peoples Temple members drank. Or the small difference between real and counterfeit currency. Or the small difference between orthodox teaching and heresy. Or the small difference between the miracles of Jesus and the “great signs and wonders” performed by false messiahs and prophets (Matt 24:24). You’ve made a classic mistake here by assuming that small differences can’t be significant. Often the small differences are the most significant and deadly because they’re harder to spot.

    • @ Cory,

      You said ” And for that reasoning, TB Joshua or SCOAN is NOT responsible for someone else’s un-holy elevation of an ‘item’ (insert any noun here).”

      When TB Joshua said ” Go get it” the anointing water, it would be in normal application of responsibility attributed to the one that says it.

      In the Black Friday or any other stampede that is mentioned here, there was nobody saying ” Go get the Smart TV or Smart Phone”

      They went by their own accord and not under a directive by another (TB Joshua) “go get it”. It’s like you give a dog the command to cross the road, without looking first if the road is free and a car hits it, and the dog dies, who is then responsible ? The owner of the dog or the dog it selves. Or is the car (security) responsible for hitting the dog that did not have time to put the brakes on to avoid it ?

      It does matter how you look at it, either way TB Joshua is then responsible for saying “go get it” since sheep need a shepherd (since they cant think properly by themselves) in to direct them and lead them to a safe place. For that I want to refer to Psalm 23 where it is clear HOW JESUS WOULD HAVE DONE IT.

      TB Joshua was so excited and bouncing up and down to release the “anointed water” that he totally forgot that there were sheep that were not taught right in how to behave correctly, which is TB Joshua’s responsibility as a shepherd (Who so desperately wants to emulate Jesus, failed completely at his task as that shepherd and is therefore guilty as charged) and not the security or anyone else.

      Accepting responsibility is for SCOANITES a big problem, because they think whatever they do there is always a way to wriggle yourself out of this responsibility and in the mean time they tell you how tempted they were and tortured by the Devil and his cohorts and vigorously blame him for all their mishaps, while it was their own choices they made where they failed miserably.

      • @ Cory,

        TB Joshua will never admit he was wrong because he has programmed his disciples, Wisemen, followers and rest of the world that he is infallible. So since they believe all this deception, there is only one way to make him accountable and that is bringing him under supervision of elders and people that are assigned to correct Temitope Balogun Joshua as every other pastor, prophet, teacher, shepherd, apostle is and was. So there is nothing wrong is opposing someone in the clergy to assess what is wrong with certain discissions which have far reaching consequences for those that were and are in SCOAN.

  47. TBJwatch, you say…”Since you’re going on at us for not addressing issues, how about you address the “for the salvation of your soul” issue?”

    So does that mean that I’ve sufficiently defended the other arguements? Because I’m seeing a pattern here…aren’t you? Something is brought up, I’ve defended it…and then after some time I get the “Ok, but what about this, or what about that”. So, what I’m saying is that I’m getting the feeling that I can sit here and adequately and reasonably respond rationally to all of your “well what about ______,”, and I respond. Then I get the “Well, then what about ____”. But for the folks on this site, I have a strong feeling, the “We’ll, what about’s…” will NEVER cease from coming. And before I know it, I’m 10 years older and I have spent hours and hours and hours of my time defending what I know to be truth (based simply on my own encounters and my knowledge of the scriptures)…with reason, videos, scripture, testimonies. My point of coming on here isn’t to make you all believers. It’s the simple fact that I can’t (in good conscience) not speak up for what I personally know and believe to true and of God, when others are speaking against it….that is the reason for me sharing on this blog. I feel that I can rest in peace knowing that I spoke up for what I believe to be right, true, and good. I’m at peace with that in itself.

    • So does that mean that I’ve sufficiently defended the other arguements?

      It means we’ve given up talking sense into you regarding the other issues. You’re right, the “Well what about’s” will never stop coming because there are deceptions at every corner of TB Joshua’s ministry. We’ve not even started on the blatantly edited prophecy videos, the numerous and credible allegations of sexual abuse (I really hope you have the sense to not let your daughters anywhere near a man with these kinds of allegations shadowing him), the public shaming of women, the violence against african church members, the fact he’s one of the richest pastors in the world and has zero financial accountability, the fact that SCOAN do not teach or practice holy communion or water baptism, the fact that he is contributing to the HIV epidemic in Africa due to his false claims of healing it (we’ve had two doctors contact us independently of one another telling us that they have been approached by people sent by SCOAN to get a HIV positive certificate when they’re not, so they can come back and get a (real) certificate showing them to be clean).

      We’ve been doing TBJW for over 3 years, and before that were aware of his ministry for a further 10. We’ve spoken to numerous people who have been SCOAN insiders at the highest level, including some women who claim to have been sexually abused by TB Joshua. We’ve heard the stories first hand, we’ve seen the damage in their lives, we’ve seen the broken families. We’ve seen families bereaved because they’ve lost loved ones to his false claims of healing (and in most cases brought about the deaths prematurely by telling them they no longer needed their meds). If you’re really as new to SCOAN as you claim, you’ve got a lot to learn. I hope that you have the humility to learn it off us instead of learning it the hard way because learning it the hard way could lose you EVERYTHING.

      • TBJoshuwatch (and everyone else on this forum), my response to your statement above would be to reference my very first post. I’d simply repost it but it’s rather long. And since it looks like we’ve gone full-circle and I’m now beginning to reference my older posts (which I’ve done a few times already now) and here, now referring you back to my first post, I think this is a good time to step away. But before I do, I want to thank you all for letting me share my experiences and rationalize/debate/discuss the concerns. I’ve enjoyed hearing, sharing and defending with you all (even you Jesse-at least until the personal insults began to fly). I want you all to know that in all of this, I have spoken from a pure heart, with ABSOLUTELY ZERO intentions of deceit, lying, or even remotely ‘fudging’ any truth (as I know it to be). My testimony stands as everything I have seen with my own eyes, experienced myself, talked to others personally about who’ve experienced the same thing, and have listened carefully to TB Joshua’s teaching and find them to be scripturally accurate. In summary, I personally stand (and can account for) these claims below in defense of SCOAN and TB Joshua:
        -TB Joshua immediately went for my knees (while I was in the prayer line) when no one would’ve known that I had bad knees (I forgot my prayer card in my room)…he still knew.
        -The power that I felt when he touched my knees knocked me (a 235lb, 6’9” man) down-twice (with just a touch of his hands)
        -The hot, tingly feeling was surreal as his hands were on them…and now (after 3 knees surgeries, tons of built-up scar tissue, and now arthritic knees) I have pain-free knees (for the first-time in about 10 years)…and the ‘placebo effect’ is all you can come up with? Then there’s the other 1000′s of people stories just like mine…all over the place.
        -The people next to me, across the hall, we’re all being healed as well. I saw people get out of wheelchairs, drop crutches and begin running, and the like. They all have the same stories I did…God used TB Joshua to heal them.
        -I watched for over an hour (in-person) while TB Joshua went up to random people in the service and spoke to them directly about things that only they and God would know. And in amazement, EVERY single person confirmed that EVERYTHING TBJoshua said to them was true. He took no glory, but only used the prophetic revelations to speak life and direction to them.
        -I saw TB Joshua personally command people to stand up (who tried to bow in front of him after begin healed) and give glory to Jesus for their healing….not him.
        -I saw 1,000′s of dollars given away to the poor, needy, sick, homeless people. for them to get a new start in life.
        -I saw a genuine person who truly cared for marriages, families, and more importantly…people souls.
        -I watched for hours as countless demons manifested in people (including one in our group-who was completely a shock to them and me) and was delivered.
        -I heard nothing but Biblical truths come from him and the Wisemen while I was there (and trust me, I check stuff like that)
        -I was immersed in countless hours of pure, sincere worship…and all of it was solely to glorify Christ.
        -I didn’t see any Ferarri’s or mansions that TBjoshua lived in, but a humble man who didn’t indulge in the pleasures of this world but lived on the grounds himself.
        -My roommate (who’s just one of many) shared with me his powerful testimony about the anointing water (I posted the video of his story above)
        -The anointing water isn’t blasphemy, nor does SCOAN believe, or tell others, that is is. I posted EXACTLY what they’ve written in their manual…stating that it’s just water. But it’s God who heals. No blasphemy. At best, you have an argument that they could be more descriptive on their labeling (but not their beliefs, as I posted above what they believe and teach).
        -I’ve experienced an anointing water healing myself with an upset stomach my last day there. It worked on me, thats all I can say (and no, I don’t idolize it…I praise God for using it to heal me)
        Again, I stand by every word I have written on this blog as what I know and have seen to be true. At best, you can say that “I’m” deceived, but please don’t accuse “me” of lying and attempting to deceive you…my words come from a pure and true heart. As for the need to even join this discussion initially…I’d just simply say that any solid, Jesus-loving person would come to the defense of someone else, and the accusations against them IF THEY DIDNT LINE UP TO WHAT YOU KNOW TO BE TRUE ABOUT THEM. Whether it’s your neighbor, a friend at work, a sibling, or even your pastor. If ugly accusations came against them, I’m sure you’d come to their defense as well (regardless if they asked you to or not) because YOUR account of the accused person just doesn’t line up with what is being said against them, based on your own personal experience, of course. That’s why I wanted to share here.
        It isn’t/wasn’t my mission to persuade you over to my side…I don’t think there’s enough stories, videos, testimony, blood-tests, and x-rays I’ll every be able to show you to convince you otherwise. But I’m grateful that you all have let me share my experience at SCOAN and now it’s time for me to move on. Thanks again for your time. -Cory

      • @ Cory,
        Quote “I didn’t see any Ferarri’s”
        You won’t see Ferarri’s, because it is Ferrari’s. Small difference, Big Difference. Never mind. We all know you are “healed” so you say, except there is no proven evidence from you than you typing it here.
        Then all your Roomy’s were “healed”, except you did not know them personally for many years or where they exactly came from.

  48. @ Cory,

    You said “I feel that I can rest in peace knowing that I spoke up for what I believe to be right, true, and good. I’m at peace with that in itself.”

    Yes, that is that false peace that is mentioned over here:

    1 Timothy 4:1-2
    Chapter 4
    1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

    I am focussing here on HOT IRON, not on the forbidding of marrying, etc etc. although I have heard that TB Joshua is not so keen that disciples getting married, especially the older women that are in his service, because quite a few are already in their thirties, forties, as well the Wisemen.

    The Hot Iron is that false peace you been able to speak to your brain and accept that all is hunky dory as long as we will accept your explanation of your self hypnotic side of your Cory who likes to tell us a deceptive story and then complaints that it took already ten years of his life after 15 posts or so.

    What you want us to do is just to shut up and give your master TB Joshua the free unleashing so he can do what he does best, which is putting up a show, stuff a camera in your face as well a mic of screaming, hip waggling, writhing women and men and knock people over with the “powers” he claims are from the Holy Spirit, Yes ?

  49. @ All,
    Ok, one more time.
    A cult !
    What is a CULT…..?
    The group displays excessively zealous and unquestioning commitment to its leader.
    Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged.
    ‪The leadership dictates, sometimes in great detail, how members should think, act, and feel.
    The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader and members (for example, the leader is considered a special being).
    The group has a polarized us-versus-them mentality, which may cause conflict with the wider society.
    The leader is not accountable to any authorities.
    People follow the leader with unquestioning adulation.
    It’s amazing how some people can be so gullible to be deceived by another human being.
    Be CAREFUL what you believe.

  50. kik,
    I am not your mentor. I am your brother. I love TBJ very much. I do not trust him. That’s all I have to say concerning TBJ for the moment.

    • Its not about to be a mentor but to help those who trust him to learn something may be they don’t know yet of the reason you don’t trust him.
      At least you could tell the truth of yourself if you think he is a true or false ,that way,everybody can have an idea that may lead them to seek the real truth.

      If you knew he is false as it says in Mark 13:22 and never tell the truth for those who don’t know yet, there is nothing much you are helping here,that was the first important thing before anything else.
      But I guess for the good communication you want to keep with people behind TBJW and supporters,you are not free to tell all the truth you think or know and that is your choice that everyone respect.Peace.

  51. Cory,
    You have gone wayyy down in my estimation mate. Really hoped you could be a standard for top debate and enlightenment on this blog. You’ve let yourself down. What relationship has light with darkness? How can you compare stuff that goes on within the Body of Christ (The Church) with crap that goes on in the mundane such as toy shoppers?! Christianity aside, does your conscience not prick you when you say helpless, stressed and desperate people as is the case here are responsible for their fate after they had been urged to come and get a one stop shop solution to ALL their challenges? Did I not tell you that someone could be a casualty of a stampede even if the person had done nothing wrong to deserve such a cruel fate? Someone could have come on time and been in the venue only for gatecrashers and latecomers to swamp the venue and trample on the weak and vulnerable. Nobody knows the exact circumstances of the unfortunate happenings and therefore we must assume the casualties were not in the wrong since they are not able to defend themselves any longer. Where is the Holy Spirit in all this?

  52. @ Cory,
    Cory wants to be knocked over by the violent power that he attributes to God.
    I hope you will watch this and see that no violence is taking place to remove pain from people who have arthritis. Watch carefully and this is not happening in a church building but on a mexico market with somebody who never has done this before and is astounded that Jesus Heals. Jesus does heal and He is the Healer. I never denied that.
    One other thing that disturbed me from is that you trust your heart.
    ” I have spoken from a pure heart, with ABSOLUTELY ZERO intentions of deceit, lying, or even remotely ‘fudging’ any truth (as I know it to be). ”
    Lets see what God thinks about your and my heart and anybody else’s.
    Jeremiah 17:9-10
    The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked:who can know it? 10 I the Lord search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.
    So for the sakes of everyone here if you trust your heart above anything else than unwavering Faith in Him, then think again. Mankind overall is unreliable, even those that are saying they are. That makes us all sinners, in need of God, in need of Salvation of our souls and that through Christ Jesus.

  53. kik and all,
    Distance is not a barrier right? There is then absolutely no need for folks to keep marching down to Lagos Nigeria just to “see things for oneself”! Stay on your comfy sofas and pray along with the subtitles on the screen. Note that you might want to keep your Bibles at hand to cross check everything you are taught. Jesus said to practise the teachings of the Pharisees and not the lifestyles of the Pharisees. Africa can be a jungle.

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