The deputy prophet’s story: Godwin Paul Agomoh speaks

An ex-disciple sent us an article by TB Joshua’s former deputy prophet, Paul Agomoh. It was published in Parable magazine from South Africa in 2010. Though we have no guarantee that all Paul’s allegations are true, a lot of what he says reflects the ex-disciple accounts on this website and others. Read the article here: TB Joshua’s deception

We’ve summarized a couple of key points from the article below:

On TB Joshua’s strategy of divide and rule among disciples:

"In the synagogue we had two levels of messages; one for the disciples and one for the congregation. What he gave the congregation differed from the message he gave us. His dealings with each disciple must remain exclusive to each one of them. It was a big crime for two disciples to stand together and discuss for two minutes. If they were found, they would be sent to face panel and explain what they were discussing. I was the head of that panel. You could be there for ten years and all you would know is what he used you for; you would not know what he used others for"

This is something reported by many ex-disciples, including Giles on this blog.

On using manipulation to create the appearance of miracles:

… We convinced her to lie on a bed as if bed-ridden. During the crusade the woman came in on a stretcher and she got up walking. However, she walked the same way that she did when we first met her.
Ex-disciple Graham gives a very similar account of faked healings in this post.


On how TB Joshua (allegedly) stole a Ghanaian pastor’s wife:

There is also a strange story about Pastor Kayode from Ghana. Paul alleges that TB Joshua first had a relationship with Kayode’s wife while Pastor Kayode was in Ghana, and eventually expelled him because he later remarried. Our ex-disciple contact confirmed several details of Paul’s story and gave her account of the events:
The part about Pastor Kayode from Ghana I had some knowledge of. He came to the church about twice to my knowledge and TB introduced him as the junior prophet in Ghana. After Agomoh was sent to Ghana, he came back and TB called a meeting to say that he urgently needed to go to the church in Ghana. I went with, along with 3 other junior prophets (two of them later left because of sexual abuse). It was all chaotic and we weren’t allowed to go to the church until the actual service where TB Joshua would minister. All I remember is TB being very negative about Kayode all the time and calling all sorts of meetings about him.
I knew the lady called sister Lola that Agomoh refers to in the article, but I had no idea that she was Kayode’s wife. And yes, she left without anyone knowing why. But that happened a lot, so you don’t question. Agomoh stayed behind in Ghana for ages. He seemed to be doing well until he wanted to get married. That was the end, TB Joshua would not have it and we never saw Agomoh again.

92 thoughts on “The deputy prophet’s story: Godwin Paul Agomoh speaks

  1. where is pasor agomoh paul now?
    is he known? is he respected by many?

    one would think that if all he was saying was true, then the man who was truly of God (himself as he claims) would be flourishing in his ministry and moving forward and the man who was of the devil (tb joshua as he claims) would be diminishing – and yet opposite is the case
    if all that he claims was happening at the scoan was happening then many many more disciples would have come out to say it… they are not all stupid. they have brains.

    And what he was saying that it was a crime for 2 disciples to be seen discussing or for other people not to know your dealings with tb joshua is absolutely ridiculous, ludicrous
    people are always discussing together and rarely do disciples even meet tb joshua alone as he is such a busy man

    and it is not true that agomoh was never seen again, he did come back to the church for a while before deciding to leave….

    • Do you know that Paul’s ministry is diminishing? Or is that the standard story given about anyone who leaves SCOAN? He certainly seems to live a less visible life than TB Joshua, but visibility or even size is no way to measure the success of a ministry.

    • Hi Radicalised. It seems that you are saying that things described in this article are not describing SCOAN as you know it. Have you ever experienced any form of reprimand or discipline as reported here, for some action that was not considered correct? Do you have contact with your family outside SCOAN?

    • I would actually agree with Radicalised that the bit about all disciples receiving one-to-one time with TBJ doesn’t seem to tally with other accounts. But that seems to be a minor point, in among many other more important bits. Like the allegations about stealing someone else’s wife, impregnating her and then trying to cover it up (I’m sure there is biblical precendent for this but not in a good way!!) and the faked healings. Those are the bits I would focus on…

      • I’d be interested to hear what other disciples have to say about this.. I’ve certainly heard very similar accounts that TB Joshua gives many small jobs to individual disciples, so they are all following orders given personally without knowing what others have been asked to do, or without discussing or conferring with colleagues. Gareth, Giles, if you’re out there, any comments?

    • @Radicalised
      “one would think that if all he was saying was true, then the man who was truly of God (himself as he claims) would be flourishing in his ministry and moving forward and the man who was of the devil (tb joshua as he claims) would be diminishing….”

      Sorry to keep harping on about another false prophet, but the Prophet Muhammed was definately not of Jesus, agreed? And yet his movement flourished. Does that make him from God?

      And consider the five missionaries that flew to tribesmen in Ecuador (movie:Edge of the Spear). Their ministry diminished pretty suddenly when they were all immediately massacred by the Indians. Does that make them from the devil?

      I dont care if this teaching comes from TB Joshua. Its not true.

  2. Agomo’s story still by far remains the most disheartening for me in all my years in Scoan, because I saw first hand through someone I knew the fulfillment of Jesus words:” But many who are first will be last…”. – Matthew 19:30.
    I knew him personally then when he was still in Scoan and really respected him- when I watched his video- I was appalled by what I heard from his lips!

    But my question is Why should we disbelieve TBJ, who in Christ’s name is healing the sick, casting the demons, helping the poor, to believe the story of such a man whose integrity is clearly not in check? Call it character assassination or whatever, but mostly, the integrity of a witness is the only thing that gives credence to his/her testimony, and the integrity of agomoh is not credible to say the least. As shown in the b o b video, Paul Agomoh was shown begging TBJ for re acceptance because he derailed when he was sent to head the branch of the church in Ghana and misused his position by getting involved in a scandalous relationship with a high-class female member of the church”.

    In fact, IRREFUTABLE EVIDENCE proves conclusively that he LIED on T.B. Joshua. exploring the evidence. In ‘Deception of the Ages – Part 4’, Paul Agomoh boldly claimed that he purchased wheelchairs, even a specific wheelchair that was used to fake the healing of Maxwell ijeh. (Forward to frame 5:20 sec.) Agomoh states in the video that Maxwell was manipulated and made to sit in and “pose” as if he was a crippled
    man. Thank God Maxwell ijeh(obviously still healed after nine years) came in the company of his wife to de bunk Agomoh’s story as untrue, claiming that he was healed nine years ago and that people should not listen to Agomoh’s blackmail against the man of God.

    Note: The ONLY PART OF HIS story in which he Specifically mentioned a NAME that could easily be verified-(Putting his ENTIRE testimony on the line) turned out to be FALSE! WHAT IS THE GUARANTEE THAT ALL THE OTHERS ARE TRUE?

    With such antecedents I often wonder where the READINESS to believe this guy springs from in some people, Have their trust become so cheaply won?- even with lies?

    ON healings being manipulated- how are the closing of the DEEP GORGES of open cancer sores manipulated? or the instant delivery of babies within seconds of prayer? Or the falling of fibriods from women? Or the vomiting of various poisonous substances atimes containing blood? Come on! Have you forgotten that even “TIME MAGAZINE” investigated TB Joshua and discovered he was the real thing? They even put him on their cover!

    How sad it is that Paul Agomoh is still trying to build a ministry By denting that of his former mentor and the a man he owed everything in his life to knowing the sordid state in which he came to Scoan-whilst deluding himself that his ministry would flourish. and its clear why many pastors believed or sponsored him- as most of them are products of break-away churches.

    What I see in all this is that SATAN WANTS TO SEPERATE MANY OF HIS CAPTIVES FROM THE STRONGEST POWER THAT DEFEATS HIM- it all fits perfectly- With the way Jesus uses T.B Joshua, satan knows he’s losing many This man is really anointed and even demons are recognising that- hence his TRUMPCARD is such stories by these EX-disciples, to discourage many from going to Scoan that would see to the END of his oppression of them. It only boils down to whether or not we would allow ourselves influenced by his story – which much depends on the firmness of our soul’s resolve.

    • Hi Soe
      you wrote
      “even “TIME MAGAZINE” investigated TB Joshua and discovered he was the real thing? They even put him on their cover!”
      So I thought that I would look at that.
      I searched the Time Magazine website and found no reference to TB Joshua
      I found a link on the SCOAN site to the Photo Pages of TIME connected to an article on “The Biology of Belief” The article does not mention TB Joshua. The first of the 16 pictures of examples of faith healing around the world is of him. The caption on the picture it is simply a description of the situation.
      Please can you post a link of the results of Time Magazine’s investigation of TB Joshua as I would be interested to read it.

      • @ Madelaine,

        Better still I’ll give you a youtube video of the magazine review to see for yourself:

        The details on the youtube site on the magazine with the story reads thus:

        “TB Joshua recognised by the world renowned TIME Magazine as one of the leading faith-healers today. People come from all over the world every week to receive healing from HIV/ AIDs, cancer, barrenness and every manner of sickness and disease! THIS IS REAL!!

        Other independent organisations investigation of TB Joshua’s ministry :

        http://www.theremnant.com/08-10-04.html

        http://www.theremnant.com/August04.pdf

        1. A detailed report about Prophet T.B. Joshua’s ministry, his teachings, background, Church and his healing ministry by New Zealand’s well-known veteran Evangelist Bro. Bill Subritzky.

        http://www.doveministries.com/monitor.PDF

      • So Time Magazine featured TB Joshua in an article about faith healing. They say “Across cultures and across faiths, the devout believe the powers of the spirit can cure the ills of the flesh’. What happens at SCOAN was presented as no more or less credible than ecuadorian shamanic rituals, witchcraft in Senegal, etc etc. In what way is this an endorsement, Soe?

        And all the other links are the exact same words repeated!! Soe, this is weak! There’s an ‘independent organization dedicated to the study of doctrine etc etc’ (who neglect to tell us the name of their organization), and they spout a lot of insane pro-SCOAN propaganda, and get it published in a home-made american Church magazine in 2004. They claim to be from Auckland, New Zealand.

        And that last link is the exact same words, but signed by two Nigerians from Lagos! So who are these independent investigators who keep changing their name, nationality, and say things like “the arrival of the true holy spirit anointed pastor (TB Joshua) into Nigerian ministries has been kicking satan left and right, and the kingdom of satan has been badly damaged’??

      • Thanks Soe for confirming my searches. You have shown the same information that I discovered.
        This is not Time Magazine “disovering that he was real” It is a caption on the YouTube video. He is not on the cover of the magazine.The page from the Time website makes no evaluation about it at all. http://www.time.com/time/photogallery/0,29307,1878443_1842216,00.html
        You presented this as a reason to trust in the man but it is actually information that he is one of many people around the world who are involved in various “faith healing” practices and there is no mention of Jesus.

      • @tbjoshuawatch,

        You asked how is this an endorsement?

        -if you ask me, that is no way an endorsement, and neither do we seek any from human sources, Just as our saviour never sought man’s testimony about Him! maybe for your sakes its necessary- but certainly not for us! It only becomes necessary for some because that is the only condition with which they would believe that incredible miracles indeed happen there-, so such a recognition is a message to the “doubting thomases” that what is happening in the Scoan is TANGIBLE and. REAL, not STAGE-MANAGED , FAKED or UNVERIFIABLE as some on this site have alleged.

        2. Throughout history There’s no where even in the scriptures where the miraculous works of other religious faiths outnumbered those wrought by God through his Holy Servants- if they were to take such a “miracle poll” in Moses day- his miracles would surely outnumber those of Pharaohs magicians, in Jesus day HIS greatly surpassed that of any other miracle worker- if there was any at all, so it was and in the apostles days, their healing powers were unmatched by any other- And the same thing we can see happening today- Gods power in the Life of TBJ Can best be described as limitless! and fears no diseases, not even those like HIV/AIDS and cancer that have threatened human existence and challenged modern medicine- which no other religious faith can openely boast of- and this is to God’s own glory – that the Name Jesus still stands supreme even in a faithless and perverse generation-that ignores the move of God!

        3.For nanardi: Moses instrument of miracles was a staff and so was the that of the Egyptians but that does not make Moses a magician! So Drawing up a similarity between them does not prove they’re of the same source, as they don’t even record the same outstanding results in quality and quantity with consistency.

        Of all the faith healers mentioned only TBJ asserts that his source is from Jesus Christ ; Shamans and the rest do not claim that their source is Christ, it would be unreasonable to think that satan would wrought a wonder and cause the glory to be ascribed to God Almighty- the very thing he wants to steal from God! this man claims his source is Jesus- why won’t you just believe! – how did the isrealites know that Moses miracles were from God – because Moses said so! And they took his word for it! We cannot constrain God to work in the way we expect Him to, HE is more than our imagination; that is why the way and manner with which God uses tbj to heal seems to defy the logic of your imagination and that of some on this site- The vessel through whom God wrought the miracles said HE IS NOT THE HEALER, THE HEALER IS Jesus Christ! What’s our problem with that? As one commenter on this site clearly puts it: he said: “we love TB Joshua because he is leading us to christ not to himself”.

    • You say that what happens at SCOAN is not FAKE but in this very discussion you have said that this man was on the cover of a magazine which was untrue.

  3. TBJ watch – yes its true that different jobs, or “assignments” are given to different people. The secrecy depends on who is asking and also the actual assignment. Disciples like me, who never were very important, would usually run into a blank wall if I asked where so-and-so was. The answer was always “he’s away on assignment”, and that would be that.
    The time when the Austria branch was in trouble and eventually closed down, there seemed to be a lot of fuss about it. A few disclples had been dispatched there to “fix” things. At the time though, I had no idea what was going on- that people there were leaving SCOAN, and that someone had died of malaria after being in Lagos.
    I was only able to piece together what that was all about from the disciples who were involved who have since left.

    Sometimes I would get some more details, which is why I concluded that it depends on the nature of the assignment. There were loads of times though when its more a case of “you dont need to know, just read your notes”.

    TB Joshua’s “inner circle” would know everything, i have no doubts. Thats why you get people on this site protesting that there is no such thing as disciples being kept in the dark, and that all disciples know whats going on. Its a half truth. It depends on who you are, how long you have been there, how “senior” you are. I know people who knew everyone’s business, and I know people who knew very little (myself included)

  4. Disciples receiving “one-on-one” time – again, it depends on who you are. I can remember getting one-on-one time with him just a couple of times, and only for a minute or so. More prominent disciples would get more trust, more responsibility, and more “Daddy time”.

  5. The article raised two concerns that I have that I have personally experienced – the first is the healings that aren’t (my friend Anna) and the second is the severance from family and friends outside SCOAN. Soe and Radicalised – I can see that you find these allegations hurtful and disbelieve them, but as your christian sister I really really really do not want you to suffer from a treatable condition or be cut off from your wider family and friends outside SCOAN who love you and have been placed into relationship with you by God.

    One of the statements made by Paul in the article and also made to me by another ex-disciple (Anna’s brother) is that husbands and wives within SCOAN are separated by TB Joshua – is this true? Do husbands and wives enjoy private married quarters within SCOAN? If not, why not? God makes them one, the English marriage service says ‘those whom God has joined, let no man put asunder’. Is TB Joshua separating those whom God has joined?

  6. hi Claire. Again, i speak from when I was there. To put it simply, married disciples do not have sex with each other regularly, if at all. Hubbie sleeps in the male dorm, wifey sleeps with the females. There were couples who were there for years, and I had to be told that they were married because I would never have guessed. They called each other “brother” and “sister” and I never saw any expressions of intimacy like a hug, or holding hands. Hence why I had to be told who was married.
    As for where all the hanky-panky is supposed to go on, I really dont know. You dont get left alone anywhere at SCOAN.

    Having said that, there was a time when two disciples were married at SCOAN, and they were given aroom in one of the accomodation area for a week or so after the wedding, but that wasn’t a permanent arrangement and it wasnt at all an example of the status quo.

    Another couple of disciples, newly-weds, joined SCOAN and eventually left. They had been married three months. The husband told me that they had no idea they would be sleeping separatly- they had been told they would be getting their own room. Needless to say, they werent happy at all.

  7. Come to think about it, there is another couple there who had been engaged for several years, again i never knew about it. Not that they should be sleeping together, but again- no holding hands, no terms of endearment or any displays of affection whatsoever. I lived an entire year without realising they were supposed to be an item, let alone fiances. I only found this out from others who have also left.
    To my knowledge they had been engaged seven years.

  8. @Giles

    You speak much clearer now of what you witnessed in Scoan like I also do and also talk less judgmental to my liking-at least, the regimented atmosphere of the church that never really gets anyone left alone as you witnessed gives even less room for the sexual sins some alleged were taking place there regularly in addition to the other points I raised in debunking the allegations.

    It appears to me (I stand to be corrected) that perhaps you might be considering returning to Scoan but your main concern is how you would be able to live there with your wife having witnessed the way couples live there. Should this thought be anywhere in your heart- even the slimmest inclination, then let me encourage you- like I always say: discipleship is all about DEEPER COMMITTMENT to the services of God of which one of the requirements to those who are married is to live AS IF THEY WERE NOT which is what you saw taking place in Scoan as apostle Paul rightly said:

    This is what I mean, brothers: the appointed time has grown very short. FROM NOW ON, LET THOSE WHO HAVE WIVES LIVE AS IF THEY HAD NONE, – I Corinthians 7:29

    At least allowing for marriage and allowing for some time together, though rare is preferrable to not marrying at all as disciples which is enforced in some christain denominations. I’ll want to thank your wife- cos I feel probably she’s been the one convincing you even in my absense.

    it would be expedient for me to say at this point that the Scoan I know will always be ready to receive you and other ex-disciple who would want to return- even if not at first as disciples but as friends of the ministry.

    • Soe, lets not get into misrepresentation again. In no way shape or form do i want to return there. I have never even hinted as much. Its a cult. I have no regrets, and i am happy to be out of it.

      • Hang on…you think my wife is pro scoan and has been trying to convince me to return as well?! Where do you get this from? This is why i rarely read your posts…no offence intended. They are always off on wacky conclusions.

      • @ Giles,

        Thanks for admitting with your mouth that you are a blasphemer, but
        Perhaps you should read your comments on this site all over again so that you’ll know I never misrepresented you- you spoke of how “one never really gets left anywhere at Scoan”, you spoke of ” “equal number of male and female” workers e.t.c you were being sincere and that is the truth you were telling as it is- but You are now saying Scoan is a cult- let me question you a little and let’s see how much proof you have this indicting claim of yours:

        ~ Do you have cults where you live?
        ~ Do you know what it takes to join a cult? The rituals and oaths of secrecy involved?
        ~ were you asked to take oaths of secrecy or any other rituals synonymous with cults?
        ~ Recount the process of your initiation if it is a cult as you say?
        ~ The members may just be commune rs but you as a disciple certainly were neck-deep in it so- which Occult ic activities were you made to carry out?
        ~ What benefits and rewards were you given for such activities?
        ~ Which threats were you given to ensure your allegiance and keep you from leaving?
        ~ Do you know what it takes to leave a cult?
        ~ Do you know what happens to those who leave their cults?
        ~ which cult do you know of that is registered in Nigeria in the way Scoan is?
        ~ which cult do you know of that carry out their activities openely and transmit their works live to the world?

        We should be careful of comments we cannot defend even by human standards – and know that for every word we speak here we shall one day account for- We have argued most of the outstanding issues on baptism, communion, wristband, anointed water etc. and these issues were thoroughly addressed with proper scriptural backing – but all you say is that I have my own interpretation yet presented no scriptural backing to prove me otherwise.

        Since this site started, did you see Scoan going down? Or do you think if I do not comment here at all that would make the ministry of TBJ fall? Like I once said on this site: my comments here are for your sakes and not TBJ’s. The greatest enemies of a man are members of his household and Scoan has fought its greatest battles and scandals within and triumphed- Even as I’m writing this i’m watching the Monday’s live service and there’s even an overflow crowd in the church that has 30 – 35 thousand seats on a working day and the works of wonder are Just as awesome as ever. Come on none of us can pull down what God has established!

        Is it because I pointed you to your real nature you’re refusing to accept but prefer reveling in grand mental-delusion?
        Whatever the case just know that Whether you realise the error of your ways or not – I’ll continue to love you and pray for you!

      • Soe, this is getting very tedious. Can I remind you that your odd love/hate thing with Giles is way off topic and I won’t be approving any more comments relating to it.

      • Additionally Soe, you make up a bunch of cult criteria to justify why SCOAN isn’t one, but already on this site there has been an article taking 14 cult identifying criteria from the International Cultic Studies Association, a worldwide authority on cults. The article showed that SCOAN fits the description of a cult very closely. Who’s criteria should we use? Soe’s “off the top of his head” ones, or the ones developed by experts over many years of observing cults? I encourage you to read the article and consider what it says very carefully.
        https://tbjoshuawatch.wordpress.com/2011/03/13/is-scoan-a-cult-an-expert-view/

    • Soe, you are too good to be true.
      About Giles’ wife, I think you’ll find that hidden among all the craziness in the How to defend TB Joshua post, she made her feelings on SCOAN quite clear. I’ve quoted it here for your convenience:

      “Hello everyone, this is Giles’ wife. I just want to add something without becomeing totally caught up with all these threads! I met Giles while he was a strong supporter of SCOAN. It has been said somewhere ‘How you exchanged an extraordinary life for an ordinary one. who knows what you would have become ‘. In his ‘extraordinary life’, Giles was totally devoted to Tbj and the ‘miricles’ but had very little comprehension of God’s love, peace, joy, forgiveness etc. Now he is learning to accept God’s extraordinary love etc and develop his personal relationship with an extraordinary God. It has been an extraordinary and exciting transformation. In my opinion he has ‘exchanged’ his devotion to the man Tbj, for a freeing devotion to Jesus. Surely that is better. I pray for us all, to develop our personal relationships with God and to become more devoted to Him. This should be our priority. May God show His love to you all.”

    • This is what I mean, brothers: the appointed time has grown very short. FROM NOW ON, LET THOSE WHO HAVE WIVES LIVE AS IF THEY HAD NONE

      That makes TB Joshua’s strange reply to the simple question “Have you ever cheated on your wife” make much more sense now. If he’s living as if he has no wife, then any extra-marital fooling around doesn’t count as “cheating”!

      Here’s what he said in response to the question you would hope a prominent Pastor could answer a direct “No!” to:

      Let me tell you one thing about the situation. What is happening, you are seeing it happen between me and my wife. So the level of understanding and the obedience in union. So…and if you call her, she would tell you that eh…well, because, I don’t want to say words that would discourage other ministers or other people out there. So…

  9. @Giles,

    Believe me when I say that I have absolutely no intention of misrepresenting you, I only said the above as they became clear to me based on several of your recent posts-in which you seemed to be able to relate more sincerely to tbj’s ministry.

    I very much appreciate the fact that even if you wanted to return or have had a change of heart – it would be difficult to publicly admit it here, perhaps if you don’t mind – we can talk away from the site. I think I can relate to you a lot better now as a sibling disciple. once again, here’s my email: cancunpearl@gmail.com

    I Love you!

    • I nearly burst out laughing! You are not serious, are you?

      Soe, what you don’t realise is the longer you carry on with these rants and STRANGE comments the worse you are making your master and cult look. Really.

    • what do you mean relate more sincerely?! What are you on about? Whats all this about me returning?

      You love me? This is getting a bit creepy.

      • @Giles,

        Yes Giles, I really love you! – particularly when I remember your first love for scoan before it waned- or so I thought till I understood better when I saw the heart beneath all your opinions here – a heart that loves scoan in the same way that I do – we do not need to discuss this here – but consider strengthening your relationship with Scoan even if you may not want to return immediately!

        Cheers***

      • first love for SCOAN?
        relationship with SCOAN?
        a heart that loves SCOAN the way you do?

        ARE YOU HEARING YOURSELF?!

  10. @Nanardi

    Now this is something I can’t take from you- you’ve certainly gone beyond Scoan saying those who deny themselves of the pleasure of their wives often or stay unmarried because of the gospel are in cults- are you now saying that the PRIESTS and NUNS in the catholic convent who have devoted their heart and souls to serve God without any form of intimacy with the opposite sex are In a CULT? Come on! Just because you cannot do something does not mean others cannot do it, I think rather you should commend them for loving Christ to the extent they were able to make sacrifices you yourself couldn’t make for Him.

    I made it clear that this command is NOT for everyone but for those who want to meet the requirements of DEEPER COMMITTMENT- which is the whole essence of being a disciple.

    • if you love me so much, then how come I never got a single letter from you or any of your fellow disciples when I was sent to Afghan? Explain that one.

      • @ Giles,

        I never knew when you went to Afgan, you know how it really is there – being such a large community- some disciples may perhaps not know other disciples closely enough to express such a concern even when they are, especially as we work in different departments – which is the category was in and I’m sure many others are as well – perhaps if not that we even met on this site, who knows if we would have known this much about each other – Yet, I sure am happy that in all your travails you did mention one Scoan person who you’re grateful to for keeping in contact- obviously one who was well aware of your situation better that most. Still Without any further use of words so as not to get tagged with stuffs like “love bombing” – I believe that with my responses to you since we met here- you should have by now read what is in my heart and know that I truly mean what I say, just as I also have read yours and known that your love for Scoan is still much alive.

      • You keep apologising for misrepresenting me, yet that is all you keep doing. The way you keep referring to “my love for scoan” is wierd and, quite frankly very creepy. You refer to this love for scoan, a relationship with scoan, and having a heart for scoan, yet you have not mentioned Jesus at all. The way you just dont seem to get this is so disturbing.

        Either you are trying to make out to new readers that a former blasphemer is seeing the error of his ways and is coming back to scoan, or you really do believe that I have had second thoughts about scoan. Either way, I’ll say this one more time – scoan is a cult. TB Joshua is their Jesus. You have displayed this belief pretty well in the above comments about loving scoan.

      • @ Giles

        Now its my turn to ask you if you are hearing yourself! Are you?- If Scoan is a cult, it means you’re admitting to being a cult member while you were a Christian – a cult nobody deceived you into becoming a member of, but you yourself, by your own act and deed willingly went to be a disciple- and then later coming to say this? There’s no constancy in such character- people are mostly deceived into cults when they’re unaware of the happenings within it- yet you knew and saw all about this ministry which then informed your decision to follow TBJ as a disciple, only to follow for a short time and later choose the path of denial- and the reason for this is clear to me;- you allowed the “wounds” in your heart to develop into bitterness for a ministry you used to Love. Whereas Love, where it is true would continue even when it has reasons to hate. Just as the Bible says: A FRIEND LOVES AT ALL TIMES, …” – Proverbs 17:17- whether when pleased or displeased!

        ~ Just remember that no one can claim to Love Jesus or is assured of life everlasting with Him, when he harbours bitterness in His heart towards a brother whether as a perpetrator or victim. how much more when we harbour bitterness against an entire Ministry~ which here means “many brothers”!

        ~ And saying “TBJ Is their Jesus” is Just plain wrong, and a very cynical description of the bond between a master who constantly glorifes Jesus and his disciples who’re undergoing a lifelong training under him.

        ~And the bit about me not mentioning Jesus? DId you really read my response? I did mention Jesus! in fact I mentioned HIM so many times that I wonder how it escaped your notice! I mentioned Him when I mentioned Love because “HE is LOVE”! – I John 4:8.

        ~ Christ is also well disguised in the objects of our hatred and bitterness to test the genuiness of our love- for this reason He asked that we love even those we see as enemies -when I read that I realised he could be them in disguise! may we not be among them that would fail such a test !

        •Cheers~

      • Soe, are you trying to make Giles feel ashamed of being a cult member? He freely admits that he was involved in a cult, so where is the shame? Cults by their very nature draw people in and are v persuasive, so there is NO SHAME in having been involved. To suggest there is is completely counter to everything else this site has said. I believe tbjwatch is here to support ex-disciples, not make them feel bad about their choices

        Btw, I may have missed something but didn’t you say in your first posts here that you weren’t a disciple? Now you claim to have knowledge of the inner workings of scoan? Have you been completely honest?!

  11. I believe that the Bible mentions husbands and wives abstaining for a time, in order to focus on prayer, but it is very clear that this is both temporary and by mutal consent. Not permanant and enforced by someone else. The normal state of things – as decreed by God – is for married couples to sleep in the same place as each other and have sex with each other (except when you have a toddler….then it’s just about the sleeping).

    I agree that the Catholic Church is not a good example of celibacy working well! It seems like when people are forced to abstain, their passions explode in other – disturbing – directions. As Paul says, better for you to marry than to burn with passion. Sex in SCOAN -allegedly – seems to be a means of control as it’s denied in healthy married relationships but practised – allegedly – between cult leader and disciples. Allegedly.

    This is way off topic btw, but I think it’s an interesting avenue…

  12. @ Giles,

    Did I not tell you about self interpretation of the scriptures by Soe ? The more Soe talks the more it confirms what this website blog is about. If they can’t get their doctrine right, how much worse it is on the level of spiritual and personal life matters. Can there not be an investigation about their spiritual claims somewhere ? Here or by a independent organization ?

  13. @ Soe,

    Go on Soe, describe L.O.V.E. ? Since humans are incapable of showing it unless God is pouring it in someone, I would like to hear from you the love you are going to describe…. is it one of those “I do something for you and you cover my back when I need a prayer for long life” or one that is taking someone else’s money and buys a status for one selves so that you can be seen as a lovely person and that you can shuffle money from another as fast as you can as long as you can pressure another in giving it.

  14. @ Soe,

    A cult is shortly said: Followers of an unorthodox, extremist, with rituals, or false religion or sect who often live outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader. One can discern at some point that the practices were not from God and were false and then decide to come out. This person was at that time temporarily deceived for a while but now has seen the truth in the Light of God’s word.

    SCOAN is indicated by this description, since the source of the powers have not been proven in any way they are from God. There are thousands of ways to heal or deliver a person but God is not in it.

  15. The bible says 2011 would be the last days? Jesus does not even know that, so once again,where are you coming up with these conclusions?!

    Just to clarify- are you saying that if you and your wife were to go be disciples, you wont really be married? Only nominally?

    • With reference to me making a fully informed decision before becoming a disciple: huh?
      1. You know my knowledge of scoan in 2003?
      2. Visitors know all the ins and outs of the ministry after a week?
      I have never even met you, yet you seem confident enough to tell everyone what i was thinking about scoan 8 years ago.
      I know you keep saying how you dont mean to misrepresent anyone, but its all you do.

    • @Giles,

      I did not say “THE LAST DAY” I said “THE LAST DAYS” which Jesus gives us direct clues to identifying when at hand and with the signs he told us to look out for in Matt 24, mark 13 and Luke 21 all around us we are well into it! Okay!

      • Yep, and one of the signs is “false prophets will rise up and perform great signs and wonders so as to deceive”! 😉

  16. Why? Why? Why?
    Why is it that when people cannot comprehend or undrstands someone they refer the things he does to other gods RATHER THAN GOD ALMIGHTY?
    You guys seem not to understand this man!
    Whats the whole discusion about cultism in Scoan?
    If we,who call ourselves christians can say such about Scoan.then where is our God?
    Or has the devil become so powerful to subdue God’s power and Majesty? Come on! Lets talk like people who knw what God is capable of doing.and not limiting Him in any way.Everything T.b.Joshua does is purely christlike.anyway, what else do i expect.everyone can certainly not speak good of you.
    Now i see why most people ignore comenting on this site.cos you guys turn the basic truth into some sort of ocult…ONE thing is clear,
    Whatever we say here is for our own good.and cannot stop Scoan from moving forward.AS IT WAS,SO IT IS.

    • First of all, there is a big difference between a cult and the occult – it seems like you’re using the words interchangably there. Secondly, this post does a good job of explaining why there is all the discussion about SCOAN being a cult, check it out: https://tbjoshuawatch.wordpress.com/2011/03/13/is-scoan-a-cult-an-expert-view/

      Or has the devil become so powerful to subdue God’s power and Majesty?

      Read about the temptations of Christ ( Matthew 4:1-11). Specifically, the devil tempted Jesus to jump off the highest point of the temple and show that the angels would protect him. In other words, prove himself with a miraculous and public display of power. He declined, that’s not Jesus’ way. God’s power and majesty is not generally about big, miraculous, public displays of power. It’s about changing hearts, and making people more like him. Also, as has been pointed out on this site time and time again, the bible says that ” false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles”.

      Everything T.b.Joshua does is purely christlike

      That statement in itself does a good job of demonstrating why there is all the talk about SCOAN/cult. Everything TB Joshua does is purely christlike? Really? So he’s perfect? Sinless?

      Doi, you seem to make out as if it’s a closed case with TB Joshua. He performs miracles, he says “In the name of Jesus” lots, therefore he is a real man of God. Have you considered what the false prophets performing signs and wonders might look like? Do you think they’d do their miracles “In the name of Lucifer”? That would be a bit too obvious wouldn’t it? Hardly likely to deceive the elect. There is a lot more to TB Joshua than meets the eye, or is broadcast on Emmanuel TV, this site does a good job of showing this. I encourage you to keep reading with an open mind.

      • God is capable of incredible miracles and has demonstrated infinite love to us all in Jesus. But we live in a fallen world and humans including this man are also capable of actions that do not glorify God.

    • You are asking “where is our God” if scoan is false…as if you think God’s display of power happens only in that place. Is this true?

      How come TB J is so hostile to Christ Embassy? whats his problem with Pastor Chris?

  17. Hi Ian.if you’re talking of God’s power and majesty changing hearts and making people more like Him.remember this is one of Tb Joshuas ministries.
    A situation where ophans believe they have a father.(JESUS CHRIST), where widows come to the awarenes that they have husband.(JESUS CHRIST), where even militants believes God cares about them.etc. How
    Much more heart changing do you want? Lets not also neglect the aspect of miracles and signs.
    Talking about Jesus’ temptation.thats completely different from people coming to Jesus for healing and deliverance.like the demon possesed boy father,bling Bathemeaus,the woman with the issue of blood…….
    But one question still remains.where is our God?
    @ giles i mean if all these are from a cult or the devil then which is God?
    Killing, stealing and destruction?

    • “if you’re talking of God’s power and majesty changing hearts and making people more like Him.remember this is one of Tb Joshuas ministries.”

      Sorry – you are wrong. It is the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

      “But one question still remains.where is our God?”

      If you mean where can we witness what God is doing today… well – I would say again what I’ve said before… every time someone turns away from their old life and follow Jesus we witness the greatest miracle of all.
      I wish SCOAN people will stop their holier-than-thou attitudes. Stop putting God in a SCOAN sized box. God cannot be contained within the walls of SCOAN.
      That is – if it is really God at work there.

  18. hi Doi
    in answer to your question-
    of course you will see miracles on the TB Joshua Show. They control the tv channel. I say this again and again. If you control what people see, you control what people think. Its called propaganda. I lived a year there and saw plenty of people declared “healed” in front of cameras. I saw many people limp away from wheel chairs with everyone clapping and cameras backing up as the guy followed them. I used to ask myself why cant God heal them fully? Why are they still limping?
    I was there a year, I saw off camera what many dont see. And I went from being fully committed to now completely against. Did I just make this up? How did I get from sounding like Soe, to…me?
    Before you say its cos of the death of my mother, might I remind people that even when she died, I still remained loyal to TB Joshua.

    For Soe, your loyalty is commendable. Please dont think I am saying this in a condescending way when I say I feel sorry for you. Not because I think you are in a cult, no. I know you wont accept this, but I will say it again. These people, who you defend so tenaciously, will turn on you the minute you change your mind about them. Read the responses that Emma got when she posted something on this site. She was there ten years, yet all they talk about is the wrath of God in store for her. The love is conditional.
    You dont know what will happen because you have never pushed that button. You dont know whats in store for you if you ever take a stance against TB Joshua because you’re loyal, and quite frankly I think you always will be. But I have seen a different side to your spiritual father and his disciples. That is why I am trying to warn as many Christians as I can: dont go there. He is not what he seems.
    I guarantee if ever you turn against the ministry, if you attack TB Joshua, they’ll turn on you in a heart beat.

    • @Giles,

      Many of the demons that are routed in Scoan speak of how they do everything within their power to prevent their captives from going there, even to the extent causing heavy rainfall! In the same manner
      there would always be winds and storms to toss us out of a place Satan stands no chance against, what then puts a great honour upon us as champions of faith is our constancy in virtue! Unlike you, when I fully discern in my spirit that a prophets calling is genuine, I stand! With him, by him and for him- whether he TURNS ON ME or NOT- I’ll be remain, Even AS the psalmist says: Let a righteous man strike me — it is a kindness; let him rebuke me — it is oil for my head; let my head not refuse it….” – Psalms 141:5 when Jesus referred to the caananite woman as a dog, in Matt 15:26, she could have as well left Jesus and label him a trickster, but she didn’t- that’s the attitude I choose to have- when I talk about a ministry God has established I mean a ministry that would not end by man’s doing nor suffer corruption, when you read your bible- hardly is there a prophet without an area they failed God, but that didn’t end their calling – even if Tbj is in error by your discernment, what have you done to restore? Rather you criticize and condemn by being totally against him. if he is used by a demon by your discernment, what have you done to deliver him?

      you seem not to realize the ernomous task given to TBJ, but I do- if you don’t want to be a part of this ministry, very fine, but why discourage others Who have found Jesus there and now see it as a beacon of hope amidst the hopelessness in this world? Can’t you see how similar your case is to that of the pharisees of whom Jesus said “woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. For you neither enter yourselves nor allow those who would enter to go in. – Matthew 23:13?

      • TBJ is not the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus is.

        Discourage = warn… because it is bad. You should’ve picked up on this by now.

        “Rather you criticize and condemn by being totally against him”. TBJ first needs to repent and turn to Jesus before there can be restoration.

        Soe – you say the same things in different words, i.e. you guys are wrong, TBJ is the best and I can quote any verse in the Bible out of context to support my claim.

        My advice to you would be to look earnestly at the post above as well as the other posts by Gareth, Emma and Giles. Read it again and again and again until you understand WHY they and others have concerns. Then address these concerns not through here-say or misquoted Scripture, but cold hard facts (anything independent of SCOAN). By TELLING us that he does not do x, y or z does not make him what you say he is any more than me telling you pope is protestant.

      • @ someone,

        What are the characteristics of Gods kingdom- is it not love, Joy, peace and power? That’s why Jesus said the kingdom is within us – he came to establish in our hearts His kingdom of love peace, joy and power to flow from our spirit to meet the needs of others!
        As one foreign visitor described Scoan as “a piece of heaven on earth”

        What an unfortunate mission you and your team are embarking on- discouraging people from going to a place where their needs are met which is a clear case of putting a stumbling block in another’s path.

        Do you think people from different countries and pilgrims from around the world stream into Scoan just to watch a sensational display of power? They’re going there because their needs are met. This is the pattern of our lord Jesus ministry – he preached the message of salvation, just as he the greatest problem solver the world has ever known, You talk so much, still what does it take? To talk! Talk is always cheap- yet how much are you being used to solve peoples problems daily? If you say TBJ is not doing something well, why don’t you do better so that we can learn from you but no, all you do is rely on words, words and more words- how does that profit anyone? The other day, a commenter on this site who not knowing what the site was all about requested for the anointed water because of her ailment, you discouraged her from getting the anointed water and offered to pray for her! Has the person now been healed? I see that you too desire to be used by God to heal, but how can you be given the gift you condemn in another? because you yourself have seen that petty words could not relieve her of her excruciating pain- That’s what the gospel is all about -goodnews to the lost (salvation), goodnews to the sick, (healing) goodnews to the demonic ( deliverances) goodnews to the poor (blessing) – not a ministry of words without corresponding action!

        People will always be attracted to wherever their needs will be met; and the needs of men vary. What I want and like might be different from what you want; so, people will always go to where their needs are met. It is not TBJ’S power, it is God, who is answering the needs of his people. Even in the Bible, people travelled far and wide to Jesus, where their needs will be met not necessarily because they loved his message above everything- You must understand that, the work of God is like honey. Wherever honey is, insects seek and find it. When God is doing a new thing in a place, people are attracted there. Can’t you see the role you’re wonderfully playing? Why won’t you refuse to follow the path of the scribes and pharisees? Are you really trying to show that you’re their descendants and are here to fulfill with His servant, what they started with Jesus?

      • Moderator – sorry for the long reply…

        “As one foreign visitor described Scoan as “a piece of heaven on earth””
        Some people are easily deceived. I was one of them, but I thank God daily for His grace!

        “What an unfortunate mission you and your team are embarking on- discouraging people….”
        Soe – instead of addressing the points I’ve made you are writing long paragraphs of nothing. You are frustrated that we will not see your way. You can keep on trying, but I will not change my mind regarding TBJ until he shows genuine repentance and fruit in keeping with repentance. He has much to answer for and people like you, in your adoration (if not worship) of him, puts him in a much stronger position. The more people question, the more pressure there will be on him. He HAS to answer the sexual abuse allegations, he HAS to answer the concerns re financial mismanagement and he HAS to answer the other major issues. If he does not do this in an open, transparent way (bring in an independent church) I (and I suspect the others on this site who are critical of him) will continue to question, question, question.

        “People will always be attracted to wherever their needs will be met; and the needs of men vary. ”
        The essence of what you are saying is that we should just ‘live and let live’. If people find their X (put in healing, deliverance etc) in SCOAN then just let them be. Why stop them?

        It is because I do not believe the source of whatever is going on in SCOAN is from God. I will continue to dissuade people from going there for their ‘healing’ and from using this so called ‘anointed water’ because if the source is not Godly you never know what the price (spiritually) of your ‘healing’ or ‘deliverance’ might be.

        God heals. Don’t need SCOAN or TBJ. My faith is in Jesus.

        Please don’t have these delusions of grandeur regarding SCOAN. It is not that great or big. You call them pilgrims – have you seen Mecca? Thousands of deluded people streaming to one place and it makes them very happy.

        ‘You must understand that…’ I must nothing Soe. And as for the pharisees comment you’ve now started passing around as insults seem to be your best argument… well – I doubt whether anyone on this site will be manipulated enough to do anything other than having a giggle.

        Furthermore – Soe – you don’t know me from a bar of soap. I’ve been manipulated enough by SCOAN to know when it happens. I can see through what you are doing and what you are saying… but please carry on… you have no idea how foolish you look.

      • The more people question, the more pressure there will be on him. He HAS to answer the sexual abuse allegations, he HAS to answer the concerns re financial mismanagement and he HAS to answer the other major issues. If he does not do this in an open, transparent way (bring in an independent church) I (and I suspect the others on this site who are critical of him) will continue to question, question, question.

        Spot on!

      • I was a foreign visitor to SCOAN and could not describe it as a piece of heaven. There are places that I would describe in that way. While I was there I was sitting on my own spending some time with God and two disciples came and told me that I must come and watch a video. That would not happen in Heaven (at least I hope not). However that is my experience and clearly others have felt differently about the place. So using one example does not define the place as heavenly. The fruit that you describe from SCOAN does not match the fruit that I describe from SCOAN.

  19. Hi someone somewhere, yes we know its the ministry of the H/S.Bt the holy spirit has no hands.ie God has no hands but uses our hands to do His works.we are His ambassadors.2 Cor 5: 20.

    Giles,
    can u try to be specific by saying they control what people watch?
    Is there anything on Emmanuel Tv. Thats not broadcast live?
    Even as much as you want to say they control things, u should be able to tell what you saw them controling.
    Speaking about people who do not walk properly, i believe you also saw them giving their testimonies and walking properly after some days or weeks.its a process.i know you witnessed things while you were there.tell me what you witnessed.

    • Agreed – we His hands and feet… so if the same power that conquered the grave lives in all of us – why follow after one man?

      I have not come across one disciple who can answer whether they are baptised in the HS or not. They don’t know – they wait to be told by TBJ whether they are or not. What is worse – many of them are not even sure if they are saved.

      Before they went to SCOAN they were confident and secure in their salvation. After being there for a while they lost all that certainty. How so?

    • Hi Doi –
      1) saying “you believe I saw them walking normally after some weeks”. This is becoming like Soe. Please dont put words in my mouth and tell me what I saw.
      There is one case I will mention however where the man WAS walking normally. This was on the videos. A Nigerian soldier had been shot in the leg, and the healing took place in the car with him screaming in pain and rocking the car. (you might have seen this one too?)
      Well, he really was walking fine the next day and I was amazed by this. They even showed the scars on his thigh where he had been shot.

      2) This was all before I was in the military. I had no idea what a real gunshot wound looks like. I do now though. I’ve seen a fair few real gunshot wounds, and they are far more serious than what his leg looked like. So I see that case very differently. His scars show what appears to be a shot-gun (I think he said it was a shotgun?) Well, that kind of weapon can easily take the entire leg off, or if not, rip off the entire thigh muscle. A few blotches of scar tissue like what he had wasnt nearly enough tissue damage.
      I think cases like that are easily believed because Hollywood gives people a false impression of what guns can actually do.

      3) To answer your question about them controlling what goes on camera and what does not go on camera – I can give you a list of e.g. people dying afterwards, or the case where he predicted Nigeria would win a football game but lost. There was also a case of a demon possessed Australian woman who came to SCOAN after the Australian crusade for more deliverane – after TBJ declared her free. This was never shown either.
      As for cases where I saw him hitting a woman, of course will never show that. But I saw it.

  20. Oh yes the power that conquered the grave lives in us.bt how many of us can exercise this power? The disciples of Jesus also had power when Jesus was with them but could not exercise it on the demon possessed boy.cos they lacked the necessary believe at that time.mark 9:23.Thats why we need people who can exercise this authority,people who can strengthen our believe.
    or can you deliver a demon possessed person? Or heal the sick,? Thats why we need a mentor Like Tb Joshua.

    Now about disciples who do not know wether they are bamptised or not. Though i’ve never asked any of them.but while i visited and saw their way of life,i know Thats not true.for sure they’ll have to work out their own salvation. cos salvation is personal but the greatest advantage they have; they are under a mentor whose character potrays christ’s, sees the visible and invisible world,and would be able to impact positively to their lives.oh what a gathering.if they cannot be certain about their salvation under such atmosphere, where else can they be.have you ever asked any disciple and they tell you they were better in their spiritual life before they became disciples? (I mean those who are still with Tb Joshua).if their spritual is growing that means the H/S dwels in them.

    • “Oh yes the power that conquered the grave lives in us.bt how many of us can exercise this power?”
      You’ve been duped to believe it is only TBJ that can exercise this power. Do you know that as a Christian you have this power and have the authority… and… the obligation to do so? Problem is that people still want to see people flying through the air and massive physical manifestations… and lazy… rather go to someone to do his magic rather than spend the time necessary with God. I know the power lives in me as I’ve seen answer to my prayers.

      “Though i’ve never asked any of them.but while i visited and saw their way of life,i know Thats not true.” How to argue with that? You said you NEVER asked them… so it cannot be true… I said I have asked them and they confirmed that they don’t know! By all means hold on to the illusion.

      “have you ever asked any disciple and they tell you they were better in their spiritual life before they became disciples?” Those there and those who left cannot give a straight answer because they just don’t know whether they are baptised in the HS or not. It is tragic, but most of them believe only TBJ is baptised in the HS.

      “mentor whose character potrays christ’s” – no he does not. If he slaps people in anger and is accused by many, many, many woman of sexual abuse he does NOT portray Christ’s character… maybe christ with a small ‘c’ as you wrote.

      ” sees the visible and invisible world” … and so does any fortune teller.

      “and would be able to impact positively to their lives”… anyone can have a positive impact on any persons life… you just have to know how. There are many organisations and people – Christian or not – doing just that… to a greater extent, impacting more people. Because they have a positive impact on SOME lives does not mean it is positive all round.

      Here is a question for you which you don’t have to answer… When you close your eyes to pray, how many times do you wish you can talk to TBJ about the problem? How many times do you wish he can intercede on your behalf, pray for you? If your answer is once (or greater) then he is an idol in your life.

  21. Someone somewhere.
    Oh! And who says Jesus was a holy man that doesn’t shout, or rebuck? If so He would have kindly preached to convince the traders who converted the House of God into a market square.John2:12.
    Or even rebuck His disciple. Matt 26 vs 51.who knows how many more Jesus did that wasn’t recorded.

    And please! I never said its only Tb Joshua that can exercise such power.so am not duped. We have other wonderful men of God around the world.

    I believe it was once said here that love is the greatest characteristics of a believer.
    Sometimes I ask myself, can God entrust the power to heal, bless, deliver to the one who does not love? GOD HIMSELF IS LOVE. 1st John 4:16.and 20.

    • “Sometimes I ask myself, can God entrust the power to heal, bless, deliver to the one who does not love? GOD HIMSELF IS LOVE. 1st John 4:16.and 20.” God either gives his gifts or he doesn’t – Samson being probably the best example. He does not put a price tag on his gifts.

      Yes, Jesus rebukes… but never violently. There is not one iota of evidence in Scripture to believe otherwise. Actually it is quite the opposite… when people came to arrest him he healed the soldiers ear knowing full well what was lying ahead of him. Never in the New Testament did any of the apostles physically fight back. Our response should be to pray for and love our enemies and those who sin against us. But please – do continue to make excuses for this man…

  22. Hello Giles.
    Thanks for proving that you actually witnessed some.
    But thats not convincing enough.
    Certainly i’ve watched that.and i remember the same man saying he has been to several hospitals both government and private.all to no avail.
    Now, with this statement everyone should know this hospitals will not just send him away without doing something.they must have tried removing some like he rightly said, given him drugs to reduce the pain and so on. They couldn’t do it all until God came in.
    So we should’nt expect the leg to be the same way it was before it was taken to the hospital.
    What are you incinuating?
    That it was all worked out? Hey come on Giles!.u saw everything that happened.how he cried like a little baby.even though he was a military man.
    Or do you want Scoan to bring him back to testify? Like they did Maxuel Ijeh?
    Imagine what this man in particular would say if he knew you’re saying this of the miracle he received.

    Secondly,i believe you watch Emmanuel Tv and hear Tb Joshua saying there’re alot of testimonies but because of time they’ll take just few.
    If you really want to know wether the Austrailian woman came back for her testimony why not ask the testimony dept.of the Church.then we can be sure if she did come back or not.

    And now about Nigerian match. I know of many Nigerian matches that Tb Joshua prophecied and they came to pass.so tell me the exact prophecy you are talking about.talking about those that died afterwords.well my question is how did they maintain their miracles?

    • how did they maintain their miracles? You saying that it was my mother’s fault that she died?
      Its a good get out clause for TB Joshua. If you get healed, then glory to God, TB J strikes again…if you die…its your own fault.

      As for the things I witnessed, well obviously you wont believe them. I wasnt expecting you to.

      As for the leg wound, I dont know if the doctors reports were fake or false, or how why you think soldiers dont cry like babies. I assure you, they can.So can actors, for that matter. The way he marched afterwards looks nothing like drill to me, so thats also suspicious. It looks like the way a civilian would think soldiers march. All these things are suspicious, but I cannot say for certain whether that really was just an actor with falsified reports or not.

      One thing I do know for certain – that is no way a gun-shot wound, especially from a shot-gun. Not a chance.

    • Are you saying that he predicts the results of football matches and sometimes gets it right but sometimes gets it wrong. I know loads of people who do that.

  23. Samson is a good example.but what happened to Him at the long run.cos he wasn’t able to maintain the gift. So maintainance matters.and one of the criteria is to Love.which you aren’t exibiting.
    Am not making excuses for Tb Joshua.He’s my Mentor. Do you think i’ll stand and hear you saying this of Him?

    All your proof of Him being false are questionable.no one is concrete.
    Now my question is why do you keep looking for fault in this man? Can i remember you that you aren’t talking about an ordinary man.but A MAN OF GOD. I believe you know the consequence if your claims of Him are wrong?

    • Doi, I ask this in all sincerity. Can you explain to me, with supporting scripture, what is a Man of God? In what way are they different to everyone else? I’d also be interested if you could point me to the scriptures talking about these consequences you mention. Thanks.

  24. @ Madelaine,

    What a really “weak comment” I LEAST EXPECTED from you! Have I now become a candidate for your character assassination? This is just as katese seems to be Trying to do below by asking if I’ve been”totally honest”? What is untrue about TBJ being on the cover of the internationally renowned Time magazine? – are you really interested in the facts and implications of this story (especially to your fake healings allegations) or just trying to plant a seed of doubt and unbelief which you yourself accused pro-Scoan people of? you seem to be trying to make out to readers on this site that i’m not honest in my opinions, so perhaps, to clarify, I should S P E L L it out for you what I meant by:

    “they put him on their cover”

    In other words Madelaine, :

    TB Joshua “FEATURES FIRST” IN the “COVER STORY” of TIME MAGAZINE which reads “HOW FAITH CAN HEAL” and rated as one of “THE GREATEST FAITH HEALERS OF OUR TIME” Known for the multitudes that come from around Africa and the world to receive healing from diseases such as AIDS, cancer and infertility in the name of Jesus Christ.

    Hope that’s Clear enough for you,

    So can either you Giles,nanardi or any of you now say that the internationally renowned Time magazine has now also been deceived by your so called “scoan’s propaganda” so much so that they went ahead to rate its UNVERIFIABLE, FAKE and STAGEMANAGED HEALINGS as one of the greatest in the world?

    Come on guys, Get real !

    Perhaps you would rather have tbj out of the picture and have such a high ranking of healers be for the shamans and other spiritualists, leaving Jesus out of the chart whom we know, believe and preach is the Master healer?

    • OK Soe, this is the entire text featured in Time about TB Joshua:

      At the Synagogue Church of All Nations in Lagos, Pastor T.B. Joshua absolves a woman of her sins, part of an effort to cure her of skin disease. People come to the church from all over Africa to seek treatment for afflictions like AIDS, cancer and infertility.

      Where does that say he is “the greatest faith healer of our time”? BTW, your use of quotation marks implies that they used that exact phrase! As for Time magazine being deceived by him, well first of all they say nothing to endorse him, and if you take that text as an endorsement then (as tbjoshuawatch pointed out), they are also endorsing ecuadorian shamanic rituals and witchcraft in Senegal. Are you equating TB Joshua with these practises?

      And as for him being on the cover, I thought you knew TB Joshua?! Even I know that’s not him!
      TB Joshua?

      Madelaine is in no way misrepresenting you. The fact is, you misrepresented the truth.

    • Well well well what a re-action. I am interested that you seem to have taken my statement about what you have written, as if it were a comment on your own character, rather than a comment on the discrepancy in what you have written. Question – Does this indicate that you come from a community where freely expressing your own opinions results in such harsh accusations?
      I can know nothing about your character apart from what you have displayed here. You and I are both sinners saved by the grace of God through the death and resurrection of Jesus.

      Having followed the links that you provided I can confidently say that TBJoshua is not featured on the cover of Time Magazine. You have claimed that he is, and that is a discrepancy. Your belief that the picture of him in the Photo Story for that magazine is so significant displays your complete loyalty to the man but no matter how many times you say that is the cover, it is still not the cover.
      My own personal conclusion about this in the light of your response, is that you completely believe your statement about the cover to be true. Therefore you were not knowingly presenting fake information. The fact however remains that in this instance what you have written in defence of SCOAN from your deep and heartfelt loyalty does not stand up to scrutiny.

  25. Hi Ian. No matter the level of sincerity you shouldn’t allow me give you the definition of A MAN OF GOD.at least not at this level.but haven’t you read the bible verse that say tourch not my Anointed and do my prophets no harm? Psalm 105:15. First chron 16:22. What happened to the people who abused/blasphem a prophet of God in the bible?

    @Giles.if you don’t watch the programe that means you’re one sided.and i am sorry to say whatever you say to me would not be acceptable cos you don’t even care to look at the second side.because to me i do consider what you say and find out the truth.so how am i sure you didn’t furge things? All in the name of hatred for this man.

    • My point was Doi, the new testament knows nothing of a category of people called “Man of God”. Even the great apostles were not referred to as “Men of God”. In Christ, we are all equal before God (Gal 3:28, Romans 3:23-34 etc…). That’s why I was genuinely interested in where you get this “man of god” status from? Cos you don’t get it from the new testament! Yes, I have read those “do not touch the Lord’s anointed” verses, they are some of the most abused verses in the whole bible, used to justify all kinds of evil by self proclaimed prophets who silence criticism with these verses. For a more accurate interpretation of these verses in their original context, see this previous post: https://tbjoshuawatch.wordpress.com/2011/03/31/%E2%80%9Cdeception-of-the-age%E2%80%9D-versus-%E2%80%9Cbeware-of-blasphemers%E2%80%9D-a-review-part-1/

  26. Pingback: TB Joshua, a false Christ? « TB Joshua Watch

  27. Pingback: The Gospel according to Temitope: Is TB Joshua adding to the Bible? « TB Joshua Watch

  28. Many people criticise or vindicate TB Joshua for different reasons. Your take on TB Joshua depends on your understanding of God’s ways and the basis of that understanding.

    TB Joshua is a man with powers obviously operational in him from his pre-Christian past.
    Just similar to “Prophet” Balaam of Mesopotamian Aramite in the Old Testament who was actually a SOOTHSAYER (Num 22 and Josh 13:22).
    And just like “Prophet” Simon Magnus of Samaria in the New Testament who though baptised had his portion in the SORCERY of bitterness rather than in Christ (Acts 8:9-13 and 18-24).

    TB Joshua has tried to carry over and syncretise his powers with some Christian-like elements. But the powers still remain obviously quasi-Christian. If TB Joshua really wants to serve God he should give his life to Christ, let go of these soothsaying and sorcery powers and follow Christ fully and only in the power of the Holy Spirit.

    If you are looking for any kind powers, TB Joshua may be good for you.
    If you are looking for the pure power of the Holy Spirit, TB Joshua is a far cry from that.
    If you are looking for biblical teaching and Christian Gospel Christianity, SCOAN is not the best place to find such even in vestiges.

    You could still have some other reasons to praise or vilify TB Joshua and his SCOAN, if so go ahead, for one man’s meat is another man’s poison. But God’s meat remains meat till eternity.

    Do not forget these scriptural references nor dismiss or downplay these points as you make your choice of what you say think or do in this matter. GOD’S GRACE to you.

  29. Whenever people misquote the Bible to claim immunity to criticism, you know they are aware of their error. If TB Joshua supporters are right they would like to subject their claims to any level of criticism. They should first use the Bible to establish their claims NOT use their delusions, stories, opinions and emotions.

    The BIble does not shield anybody from critical judgment.

    In Joh 7:24, Jesus Himself said

    “JUDGE NOT according to the appearance, BUT JUDGE righteous judgment.”

    The undisputable fact is that TB Joshua IS DISGUISING HIS PRE-CHRISTAN POWERS AS THOUGH THEY ARE CHRISTIAN.
    This is typical of satanic agents as the Bible points out:

    2Co 11:13-15

    “(13) For such are false apostles, deceitful
    workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

    (14) And no marvel; for Satan himself is
    transformed into an angel of light.

    (15) Therefore it is no great thing if his
    ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness;
    whose end shall be according to their works.”

    Whoever has ear should hear.

  30. Pingback: Healing at SCOAN and healing in the bible « TB Joshua Watch

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